Atem mini pro cache full

Questions about ATEM Switchers, Camera Converter and everything live!
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Sfloor

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Atem mini pro cache full

PostMon Jul 06, 2020 7:41 am

Goodday,

I am the happy user of an Atem mini pro device. Switching and recording is flawless but with livestreaming I am experiencing some issues.

My setup:
- 4 input devices into switch
- 1 preview out
- usb-c to computer for control software
- Wired network to a router to send data to YouTube.

Connectivity test done on seperate device, connected to the router, 60mbit download / 40 mbit upload
When starting the stream, all seems fine, but after half a minute the cache starts filling up.

Bitrate is set to 4,5 mbit. The internet speed should be sufficient, but still, the cache fills up until full.

Cache full means lost data, which is noticeable in the stream, since a lot of frames are missing.


Anybody experienced the same? Any solutions?
For now a solution would be to connect the switch to device and use it as webcam input for the stream, but I rather do it over network.


Thanks!
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Sfloor

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Jul 07, 2020 2:53 pm

Attached a picture of the cache which is filling up. This is approx 30 sec after starting feed to YouTube.
Note that the data rate is the same as set quality. Cache dump problem?
Attachments
E8DEE2EA-1EE2-406E-9379-468FE2B6F14C.jpeg
E8DEE2EA-1EE2-406E-9379-468FE2B6F14C.jpeg (51.25 KiB) Viewed 2907 times
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RSDancey

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Jul 07, 2020 3:32 pm

Can you disconnect the USB cable and control the Mini via ethernet? The system may be sending some stream data to the computer and some data up the wire directly.
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Sfloor

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Jul 07, 2020 3:36 pm

Will try, but cannot see how this affects the cache
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Sfloor

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Jul 07, 2020 3:52 pm

RSDancey wrote:Can you disconnect the USB cable and control the Mini via ethernet? The system may be sending some stream data to the computer and some data up the wire directly.


I am just thinking about this. The switch was not connected to a pc with internet access. So it couldn’t send data away.

Also, another try it was not connected to pc, it was just a standalone without control panel open.
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tmrufe

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Jul 07, 2020 4:06 pm

We're currently troubleshooting the same issue. It took a few weeks to get the RTMP stream to handshake/stream to BoxCast (we tried multiple different resets of the Streaming.XML file, with BoxCast's help/confirmation that our code was correct from the start, as well as a few other integrator friends we know just to get some other minds on it). It finally started working last week, but regardless of streaming quality set in the ATEM, it still fills the cache (not to mention what's going out is extremely poor quality), even though we're able to stream out OBS at full quality with no issues. We've checked the network/port configurations, and even moved the ATEM to the OBS Comp Ethernet that streams fine and the ATEM seems to be having issues.

OBS is set at 5Mb/s, and we've mostly be trying to test the ATEM at the 'Streaming Med' profile for 4.5Mb/s.

Our entire system is set at 1080p30 for consistency. Every step of the way we've gotten confirmation that we do, in fact, know what we're doing, but so far that hasn't solved any of our problems...
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Rob Munzing

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Jul 08, 2020 4:00 pm

We expierance the same problem with BoxCast so please respond with any further information they may share and thanks for this confirmation.
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oliveramr

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Jul 08, 2020 8:03 pm

I have the same problem, some solution.

i try in youtube and facebook.
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Sfloor

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostThu Jul 09, 2020 8:06 am

tmrufe wrote:It finally started working last week, but regardless of streaming quality set in the ATEM, it still fills the cache (not to mention what's going out is extremely poor quality), even though we're able to stream out OBS at full quality with no issues.



Can you explain what you did to get it working?
Could it be a convert cache? so a cache which converts the video to the set quality?

It is strange that the outgoing data is reaching 4,5 mbit while the video is still going out broken... even though it reaches the set quality...

Seems that I am not the only one and more people are experiencing this issue. I've send a support request to BDM aswell, will revert here when I have a response.
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Sfloor

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostFri Jul 10, 2020 11:56 am

Problem solved! Or at least, problem moved!

I found out that the switch is uploading with 4,5mbit when I set the quality to 4,5 mbit. So it cannot be a network problem. When I noticed the cache filling up I started thinking about what the switch is doing. And than I came with the idea that the switch needs to convert the video output to a much lower quality. So the switch is totally capable of handling the upload, but is not capable of converting a 1080p video to a quality this low.

I've tested this with all settings as before, with the only change that I set the upload quality tot 9mbit.

No cache problems, stream was running smooth.


So, if your cache fills up and you reach your set quality with your uploadspeed, take a higher upload quality and problems will be solved (until you reach the capacity of your bandwith)

I've send this story to BMD aswell, awaiting their response.
I've searched a lot to find an answer to this problem, couldn't find any documentation on it.

I hope that the above helps others aswell.
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JoshWise

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSat Jul 11, 2020 2:50 am

Yes, please let us know what Blackmagic says.

I am having a similar issue, except I cannot get online whatsoever. On-Air flashes, but data rate is capped at .16 mbps and the Cache fills up over the course of 30 seconds. The live stream never reaches its destination either on all 6 data rate settings.

Have troubleshot the .xml file, key, rtmp, all of that to confirm I am entering everything correctly. Currently on network that has 150mbps and I'm not locked to any bandwidth and MTU is set to 1500 (which on another BM thread solved another guy's issue).

ATEM control works via all methods:
-network (separate ethernet cords to computer and Mini Pro)
-via usb from computer with ATEM Mini hooked up direct to network via ethernet (although can't use USB because we record using it)
-Computer hooked to network via ethernet and ATEM hooked up to computer via ethernet

AND all of these yield the same result: .16mbps and cache fills.

Any other insights appreciated, hopeful since this thread is fresh. TY.
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Denny Smith

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSat Jul 11, 2020 6:48 pm

Good catch, thanks for passing this along.
Cheers
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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koolkalangdude

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Aug 05, 2020 7:49 am

Any update on the Cache Full of atem mini pro? We tried the 9mbit upload setting but still similar issue, cache full. Any help will be much appreciated.
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Rileyvasquez

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSat Aug 08, 2020 1:49 pm

Any more luck or thoughts on this?

I was using an ATEM Mini Pro to stream and last night had a stream crash right before the show started. We tested the stream multiple times and didn’t have any issues. But sure enough, 5 minutes before the show started we started the stream with just a graphic and the cache filled up in about 30 seconds. Super frustrating!

I ended up using Blackmagic as just the switcher and letting OBS handle the stream...and it worked perfectly. It even made me wonder why use Blackmagic for a stream ever again!?

If anyone has more insight on this, I’d greatly appreciate the info.
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newcityjim

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostFri Aug 21, 2020 6:15 pm

Hey Everyone,

I have had the same issue but my upload has been set at "Streaming Medium" or 7.0 Mb/s.

Any further insight into this problem?

Thanks!
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mmadeiros

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSun Sep 06, 2020 4:41 pm

Hello all,

Been having this same issue for the last few weeks. When the cache fills up, the connection to YouTube Studio starts dropping, and the stream starts falling apart. I've read on other threads that some users report very high operating temperatures. This has been my observation whether we use the unit indoors with AC, or outdoors. We've had to unplug the unit a few times when it became unresponsive, presumably from overheating. For example could not go "off air" from the unit or control software...simply had to unplug. This is being used outdoors (under a tent, but still 85+ degree air temp.). The issue of the cache filling up seems to loosely correspond to the hotter weather we've had the last couple of weeks. If anyone has any other thoughts, it would be much appreciated! Seems I am not alone with this frustrating issue.

Will try to find a decent laptop cooling pad and see if that makes any difference next week, and will try to report back!

Thanks much,
Matthew
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pconnord9

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostFri Sep 11, 2020 8:43 pm

Very keen to see any solutions for this
I have been streaming daily for 10-12 weeks without any issues.
Over the last 3/4 days we are now seeing cache full problems.
Nothing else has changed which is very confusing.
Streamed direct from Atem Mini Pro via Ethernet port to Castr.io same as many weeks before.
( 20mpbs upload speed tested on Ookla )

would appreciate any help or advice
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swallow

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSat Sep 12, 2020 1:18 am

Save all settings to xml file and check audio rate.
Some of you may have different problem(s) but it was the problem I was having and after changing it to 320Kbs (and now 256Kbs), it cache was no longer filling.
Ethan Doh
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Cubacane

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSun Sep 13, 2020 3:49 pm

I've been having the same problem, whether I stream to YouTube or CASTR. But it seems to change by day. On Thursday I was able to stream for two hours with no problem. This morning I barely made it five minutes. Has anyone else had this issue resolved by the audio fix above? I don't want to mess with the code unless I HAVE to (like I did for CASTR).
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mtbills

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 3:10 am

I checked our XML file, and the audio settings were not the problem. No progress on troubleshooting why our cache fills up so quickly.
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Brennyboy

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 3:30 pm

I`ve been having the same problem with the Cache filling up. I was streaming to youtube at medium Bitrate then because the cache was filling up I decided to drop to the low 4.5mbits, but still had the same issue. I checked the upload speed of the internet and it was a good 20 mbits so the problem wasn`t with the upload speed. I also had a problem with going off air as it seemed freeze.
I was beginning to think that the problem was with Youtube but now I think that Blackmagic needs to Address this problem Pronto.
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mtbills

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 8:50 pm

Brennyboy: Your queue is full, so when you press stop, that does stop recording. However, the interface stays "on air" as it slowly empties the queue by continuing the upload. If you wait for the queue to empty (annoying that you can't see the exact queue percentage when it is under 40%), the system will then close the stream.

Given the number of users reporting the unexplained "queue full" behavior while streaming to YouTube, I agree that BlackMagic should take a more active role in troubleshooting this issue.
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Brennyboy

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSat Sep 19, 2020 2:35 pm

Thanks Matthew, I sent an email to Blackmagic,here is the reply:
Hi Brendan,

I'm sorry to hear you're experiencing this behaviour, I'll do my best to assist you with this.

Our ATEM Mini Switchers have a small amount of internal memory called cache. If the network connection becomes slow enough that it cannot support the data rate required for the video stream, then the cache will fill with video frames to compensate. If the cache memory reaches 100%, then it will no longer be able to compensate for the lack off bandwidth.

You can monitor the cache status on the MultiView Output. If it does reach 100% then you will start to see performance issues occurring with the stream, it may start dropping to black or the stream might drop out completely. The On Air indicator in the ATEM Control Software may also start flashing to indicate a poor connection.

I would recommend connecting your ATEM directly to your internet router via ethernet, this will usually improve the performance of the stream as the ATEM should have access to more bandwidth. If the ATEM is connected to the internet over a WiFi network, then this could limit the bandwidth and cause the stream to become unstable.

I would also recommend adjusting the Stream Quality setting in the ATEM Control Software, please try the Medium or Low option to see whether this improves the behaviour. I'm asking you to try this because it sounds like the behaviour you're experiencing is bandwidth related. The cache will only fill up if the Internet connection isn't fast enough to handle the stream.

Regarding your internet and network connection speed, it needs to provide at least 9Mb/s to the ATEM Mini Pro for High Quality, 1080p60 streaming, if the network bandwidth drops below this then the cache will start to fill up. So for High Quality you will need 6 to 9 Mb/s, for Medium Quality 4.5 to 7 Mb/s and for Low Quality 3 to 4.5 Mb/s.

For advanced users, you could investigate the QoS (Quality of Service) settings on your router to prioritise streaming, if you can then this could free up some extra bandwidth for video streaming. Always consult with your IT or Network technician to help with this. Any changes to the router should be performed by a qualified technician.
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rbwilliams67

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostSun Sep 20, 2020 2:25 pm

Same problem here, used the mini pro successfully for a few weeks and now the cache is filling quickly. I have 24+ mbps upload speed so I don't think that is the issue
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Brennyboy

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostMon Sep 21, 2020 3:32 pm

Richard, do you think the problem could be with YouTube ?
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bmpeter

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Re: Atem mini pro cache full

PostTue Sep 22, 2020 9:48 am

2 weeks ago my direct streams to Youtube were fine, but same settings and gears on last week was choppy because of the cache was full quickly.
There wasn't any software update between my 2 streams.
So to me it looks like a Youtube issue, somehow.
Peter

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