Constellation 8K Firmware Question

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fankefang

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Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Dec 23, 2020 8:40 am

Hey there,

As a Constellation user, I am constantly wondering when will my switcher get a firmware update. The Constellation 8K is still stuck at firmware version 8.1.2.

Will there be a featured firmware update in the forseeable future?
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David Hutchinson

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Dec 23, 2020 8:44 am

What do you need in a firmware upgrade? What are you missing?
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Raphaël Jacquot

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Dec 23, 2020 9:03 am

David Hutchinson wrote:What do you need in a firmware upgrade? What are you missing?

proper sound routing, for starters
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David Hutchinson

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Dec 23, 2020 10:56 pm

Raphaël Jacquot wrote:
David Hutchinson wrote:What do you need in a firmware upgrade? What are you missing?

proper sound routing, for starters

I don't think that is ever coming on the Constellation.

I'd like to see the DVE go over 100% screen size as it does in the mini
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Xtreemtec

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostThu Dec 24, 2020 9:16 am

Audio Routing,
Multi channel audio embedding into PGM signal Channels 1-12
PGM capture to Media Player ( Available on the Mini )
External Timecode input ( maybe on the analog inputs?? )
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Xtreemtec

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostThu Dec 24, 2020 9:33 am

And a lot of people seem to agree that Audio routing / embedding is a big issue on the Constellation>>
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=129361
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Ben Harper

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSat Dec 26, 2020 11:34 am

Even without the audio routing capability - lack of external timecode input ( maybe on the analog inputs?? ) is stopping us investing...
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Dec 27, 2020 5:08 am

Constellation has 4 M/Es, so I would like to have at least 4 stereo audio buses to compensate those 4 M/Es. Also, I would like the option to choose audio source of an output between the 4 program buses I just mentioned, or the source audio if the output is set to an input.
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Raphaël Jacquot

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Dec 27, 2020 4:42 pm

fankefang wrote:Constellation has 4 M/Es, so I would like to have at least 4 stereo audio buses to compensate those 4 M/Es. Also, I would like the option to choose audio source of an output between the 4 program buses I just mentioned, or the source audio if the output is set to an input.

considering how this device is built, I'd say there should be this much all routable to anywhere...

on the input side
* 40x16 channels (from SDI)
* 32 channels from MADI
* the channels from the intercom connector

on the output
* 24 (outs) +4 (multiview) x16 channels to sdi
* 32 channels to MADI
* the channels on the intercom connector

anything less is not complete
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Dec 29, 2020 2:14 am

I agree with both points here. I just got my constellation and not being able to size super source bigger than %100 has already been a problem. Keyed a work around but wasn't ideal. Also routing audio is an option in my 12 year old sony switcher. Didn't realize it wasn't an option with this. Pretty much makes it so I need a router to be able to iso record embedded audio where otherwise I wouldn't even need that. Seriously disappointing and I hope both issues are addressed with a firmware update.
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Jan 05, 2021 12:30 am

I've just realised on the Constellation you can't get the Media Player audio out through MADI when in 4K mode? :?: :!:

That's somewhat annoying.

I was hoping to send all my audio out to the Mixer but I'm still going to have to mix the MP into the program in the Constellation.

With limited outputs, 32 stereo pairs per MADI channel, it's a real shame we can't route the audio we want out through MADI. That would have been far more useful.
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Roman Pytkin Pekarek

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Jan 05, 2021 12:10 pm

Maediaplayer can have audio ?
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David Hutchinson

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Jan 05, 2021 11:20 pm

Yes :D . You can load a sound file in there.
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Roman Pytkin Pekarek

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 12:24 am

Great ! Thanx David .. Never tested it :)
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Xtreemtec

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 8:46 am

Yes when have a stinger or image sequence, You can ad sound to it. ;)

But indeed that audio routing is crucial to a mixer like this!!!
Daniel Wittenaar .:: Xtreemtec Media Productions ::. -= www.xtreemtec.nl =-
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 2:58 pm

I was firtst time start Atem software control today .. I see audio on MP ..

That was the problem ... this is feature of Constelation Only..
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Xtreemtec

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 4:16 pm

Nope my 4Me Atem have this for 5 years already ;)
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 4:45 pm

Crazy .. i have 4me in OBVAN and never seen it :)
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David Hutchinson

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Jan 06, 2021 9:46 pm

It's also on 2ME
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostFri Apr 09, 2021 4:39 pm

I'm wondering when some of these issues will be fixed? I am considering the Constellation , but the lack of updates is certainly making me reticent.
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSat Apr 10, 2021 9:39 pm

Andy Coulthurst wrote:I'm wondering when some of these issues will be fixed? I am considering the Constellation , but the lack of updates is certainly making me reticent.

If you need a Constellation just accept you'll be doing audio out with the switcher. Most big events where you would NEED a Constellation would have separate sound anyway.
Constellation is an amazingly powerful value for money switcher. Don't let these niggles stop you from buying. If you are waiting for firmware updates to make your decision, you probably don't need it. If your jobs demand you need a switcher that big you'd have to go out and buy.
Just do it :D
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 9:22 am

Interesting - but actually the issues of more concern to me are external timecode and the ability to go beyond 100% scale on dve/supersource.

The constellation would be replacing an Atem 4k 2 M/E and 40x40 router.

I'm sorry to say - although I truly love BM equipment , I've learnt to stop reading and thinking "well of course it would have to have functionality X" , because I'm often disappointed.

For example - still waiting for B level on the original audio monitor.
Still waiting for 1080p50 on the Hyperdeck 3G ( non pro ).
BRAW on the 4k ursa mini would be nice as well.
And I'm not going to get into the original big ursa discussion.

Perhaps to bring this back to my "wants" - perhaps people with a constellation can confirm the following.
Is timecode embedded on ALL SDI outputs ? If not - which ones don't have it?

As there is no external LTC timecode - is the only method for syncing timecode via the Atem software ( and can you confirm it syncs to the PC time ? Or is it just jam sync ?
( I also have an atem Mini which will sync to pc time , but the Studio HD only allows Jam , not PC time ).
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 1:07 pm

Andy Coulthurst wrote:Interesting - but actually the issues of more concern to me are external timecode and the ability to go beyond 100% scale on dve/supersource.

if beyond 100% scale is important put an ATEM mini on one of the inputs? I have to admit this is one of my big feature requests.

Andy Coulthurst wrote:The constellation would be replacing an Atem 4k 2 M/E and 40x40 router.
Hmmm yes maybe, but you do lose some other functionality such as 4xDVE, Teranex converters on inputs, New Chromakey, Fairlight audio etc. it depends if these are important to you.(they are to me) and don't think you can get away without a video hub as the ATEM Constellation has 24 outputs. If you want to do ISO recordings you'll need a video hub to route audio to the recording.

Andy Coulthurst wrote:As there is no external LTC timecode - is the only method for syncing timecode via the Atem software ( and can you confirm it syncs to the PC time ? Or is it just jam sync ?
( I also have an atem Mini which will sync to pc time , but the Studio HD only allows Jam , not PC time ).
Afaik there is no way to get external timecode into Constellation, However I can confirm all outputs (except Multiviews) do carry TC. It's a shame the Multiviews do not since I put them through a Teranex Mini 12G SDI to HDMI converter which has TC out. This means I have to put one of the other outputs through a Teranex mini to be able to record TC on an external audio device for example, something we do when filming concerts so the separate audio recording can be synced.

The Constellation has Free run time code and Time of Day - I've never been able to sync it to the computer (what am I missing?) but you can set it to present time and it'll run from there.

Hope this helps in your decision :-)
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 4:23 pm

Okay - another question.
If I route each ME bank out to an aux - does the audio come from the ME bank ? Or is it still program output ?

And just an edit for another question.
If I get the Madi card for a behringer X32 - can I send audio out to the X32 and then choose a madi channel for program out?
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 9:42 pm

Andy Coulthurst wrote:Okay - another question.
If I route each ME bank out to an aux - does the audio come from the ME bank ? Or is it still program output ?


All ATEMs are the same they have 1 audio bus the program out is on everything even the different M/Es (some ATEMs have a monitoring bus)

Andy Coulthurst wrote:And just an edit for another question.
If I get the Madi card for a behringer X32 - can I send audio out to the X32 and then choose a madi channel for program out?

SO what I do is MADI out into an RME DigiFace Dante to convert it into Dante then mix in an A&H SQ6 then return program back in the reverse direction. You can do it with just a MADI card but I have a lot of kit that is Dante so that workflow works for me. Round trip is less than 5mS.
If you want outputs with different audio you'll have to do that after the Constellation for example with a Video output being combined with an Audio aux output from your mixer in something like a Teranex AV which would allow you to resync.
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 9:49 am

David Hutchinson wrote:The Constellation has Free run time code and Time of Day - I've never been able to sync it to the computer (what am I missing?) but you can set it to present time and it'll run from there.

:lol: :lol: :lol: So i'm not the only one that is NOT getting this to work... :roll: Also though ed it was me not getting this to work.. :P

And the MOST advanced atem with the MOST advanced audio mixer inside still just outputs ALLLLLL outputs with PGM stereo 2 channel audio mix..

Routing with original audio from source to AUX isnt possible.. Its just a shame that features like this and Multi audio channel embedding is not possible..
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Roman Pytkin Pekarek

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 10:54 pm

But routing of 4 channels audio from inputs into madi is fine .. nomore demebeders ..
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Apr 13, 2021 10:05 pm

Xtreemtec wrote::lol: :lol: :lol: So i'm not the only one that is NOT getting this to work... :roll: Also though ed it was me not getting this to work.. :P

It's so much nicer to know the pain is shared. :?
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Apr 14, 2021 12:33 pm

Roman Pytkin Pekarek wrote:But routing of 4 channels audio from inputs into madi is fine .. nomore demebeders ..

Just a shame you can not route anything inside that Madi layout, Need a lot of 12G Embedders to get multiple channels of Audio into your PGM feed and several aux lines...

In our setup we would need about 8 to 10 12G embedders to do what we want.. If only BMD allowed routing and multiple channels of audio into PGM.... :roll:
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Roman Pytkin Pekarek

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Apr 14, 2021 10:25 pm

Daniel : Why ? U want mixing in ATEM ? Im converting MADI to DANTE and sending all audio into audio console .. Its great ..
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSat Apr 17, 2021 7:26 am

Okay - more questions for people with the Constellation
1. Is the mediaplayer media retained during reboot?
2. When saving default state - is everything retained ? (Television Studio HD doesn't appear to retain the source labels )
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSat Apr 17, 2021 9:06 pm

1. Im not sure .. Im not rebooting it ..
2. TVS HD save source labels ..
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 18, 2021 5:59 am

Roman Pytkin Pekarek wrote:1. Im not sure .. Im not rebooting it ..
2. TVS HD save source labels ..

Not mine ! Hmmm need to look at that.

So - I checked.

1. I powered up my TV Studio HD
2. I changed the Labels via Atem Software Control
3. I selected save startup state.
4. I quit Atem software control
5. I de-powered and re-powered my TV Studio HD
6. Labels are back to the default.

I am on 8.1.1 ( and Atem Software is 8.6.1 - so I assume 8.1.1 is the latest for the Atem HD )

What am I doing wrong ?
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 18, 2021 11:11 pm

I was stayed on 7.5.2 .. Maybe thats is reason, why my ATEM works .. Today i was loaded previously saved settings .. Managed some changes for today's work and save startup state .. after restart is everything there ..
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostMon Apr 19, 2021 9:42 am

Roman Pytkin Pekarek wrote:Daniel : Why ? U want mixing in ATEM ? Im converting MADI to DANTE and sending all audio into audio console .. Its great ..


As Said we use a lot of embedded audio for recording into multiple audio tracks on the hyperdecks in 12G. Several aux lines need different embedded audio on it..

This is something that big broadcasters often use.. And it's not that hard to do if you already can scale and process up to 40 inputs and 24 outputs.. Then audio should be a biggie to fix.. But it feels like the big hold up is that the Atem software needs a big overhaul to be able to select and embed multiple channels of audio into outputs.. And that is something that might be an issue..

Anyway i'm not sure what to think about this anymore.. But i do know that it's quite useless to have so many channels of Madi input into the Atem without any proper audio routing of multichannel embedding.. :roll:
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostTue Apr 20, 2021 10:35 pm

Daniel : I dont like BMD embeders .. its expensive and i have problems with AES on it .. Now in new TV i was bought AJA 12G DANTE embeder .. Its two embeders in one .. I really love it .. Reason is the same .. I want to record 16 audio tracks onto 12G Hyperdeck ..
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Apr 21, 2021 9:39 am

Roman Pytkin Pekarek wrote:Daniel : I dont like BMD embeders .. its expensive and i have problems with AES on it .. Now in new TV i was bought AJA 12G DANTE embeder .. Its two embeders in one .. I really love it .. Reason is the same .. I want to record 16 audio tracks onto 12G Hyperdeck ..


Nice we are designing our own at the moment.. 16in 16out embedder + de-embedder on 12G. With a option for Dante, Ravenna, AES67.. But that is a project that will see the light of day this summer.. :)
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostWed Apr 21, 2021 10:58 pm

daniel : yes .. This AJA is deembeder too .. I though its one embeder/deembeder on card .. but there is two .. Only small problem is Open gear format .. So I needed expensive frame ..
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostSun Apr 25, 2021 4:30 pm

Andy Coulthurst wrote:Okay - more questions for people with the Constellation
1. Is the mediaplayer media retained during reboot?
2. When saving default state - is everything retained ? (Television Studio HD doesn't appear to retain the source labels )

Answering my own questions.
1. Media is not retained.
2. Labels are retained ( for the ATEM Studio HD it looks like a firmware bug for fw>7.5.2

Also - flying key can go beyond 100% , so thats a way around the supersource scale limitation ( not a great solution - but good enough for me ). Use an upstream keyer , place your source as the fill , select flying key , and scale beyond 1.0

The audio limitations are painful though. And the timecode not syncing to time of day - looks like a bug in the atem control software.
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Re: Constellation 8K Firmware Question

PostMon Apr 26, 2021 11:05 pm

We started to work with Constelation + Atem Advanced panel 2ME .. And its sometimes strange .. Editation of Supersource is crazy .. Really stupid .. Lot of buttons .. But its much worse than old ATEM panel ..

I have here old ECHOLAB ATEM + panel .. Its lovely .. U can save your Supersource setting onto card .. Why BMD missed this function ?
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