10G Ethernet max length for Studio Camera 4K Pro

Hello,

Anyone knows the max recommended ethernet cable length for the latest Studio Pro camera ?

Does it change depending on wether it's Cat6 or Cat7 cable ?

Here are the specs for 10G Ethernet over copper cables (10GBASE-T):

• Cat6: maximum length 55m (180 ft)
• Cat6A: maximum length 100m (328 ft)
• Cat7: maximum length 100m (328 ft)

Cat6A cables are manufactured to more stringent standards than Cat6 cables, which reduces the crosstalk between the internal twisted pairs and allows for the longer transmission distances. Both Cat6 and Cat6A cables are available in shielded (STP) and unshielded (UTP) form. Cat7 cables are usually fully shielded, both individually around each of the twisted pairs and with an overall shield around all 4 pairs inside the cable jacket. This typically means that Cat7 cables are thicker and heavier (and often more expensive) than Cat6 or Cat6A.

Of course, in a real world environment, with a lot of interference from other sources, there's always a possibility that you may not be able to reach the maximum distance of the specs. So you may want to use a higher spec cable for longer runs that are near the recommended limits.

hello,


assuming BMD use TICO SMPTE 2022-6 (IP packetized SDI) over standard 10GBaseT layer (IEEE 802.3 AN defined), I will say Max length is 99m. But for secure link take no more then 2/3.

Cat6a or Cat8. Forget false cat7.
bandwidth : cat6=250MHz cat6a=500MHz cat8=2000MHz

Take S/FTP cable (stands for shielded foiled twisted pair). It will protect a little in real environnent.

Respect some prophylaxis rules like no close to power line cables, no proximity with decharge lamps, no installation near radio transmitters...

Hi everyone,
Thanks for all this informations.
Are all this length recommandations also valid for the PoE++ feed that the cable is supposed to carry alongside the 10Gb of data (in order to power the camera)?

Is there any heavy duty ethernet cable manufacturer on the market that you could recommend?
This 10Gb/PoE++ ethernet solution sounds amazing but without sturdy and easy deploying and rolling cables, it might get trickier than expected...

Intensity is the critical POE parameter : injector must supply enough energy to supply apparatus. But with BMD products at each side, I guess they choose a correct solution (802.3at or better 4PPoE)

There are good datacom cable manufacturers all over the world. Any 24AWG certified cat8 cable will do the job. Big diameter = more power + more lengh.

It usually works especially if you keep a good marge (under 66m).
But as said before, even best cable with bad deploying will get transmission losses. (distance with power lines > 0.3m, no parallel cables, etc... / taking care of earthing / noise in 3phases system and so on !).

We have now 3 choices : copper ethernet can be interesting for moderate size fixed installations.

I would not be suprised if the manual of this Basestation, when released in October says maximum 50 meter of cable.

All standards aside.. But realworld pratical use is always a different beast..

All standards aside.. But realworld pratical use is always a different beast..

You do have a point Fiber is not dead !

Hi guys

I understand that my next comment is Off Topic of this post, Sorry.
But I have a question, maybe someone knows the answer.

Why Blackmagic didn't use etherCON RJ 45 connectors for the new BM Studio Camera and Studio converter ???

EtherCON-6A.jpg (55.87 KiB) Viewed 7470 times

It will be a "robust" option for this type of camera concept/design

In fact the camera has 4 professional XLR connectors (2 audio + 1 Intercom 5pin + 1 Power 4 pin)

Hi everyone,
Thanks for all this informations.
Are all this length recommandations also valid for the PoE++ feed that the cable is supposed to carry alongside the 10Gb of data (in order to power the camera)?

Yes, POE++ Type 3 (60 Watts) and Type 4 (100 Watts) use all 4 twisted pairs to carry power which allows for greater power delivery than the earlier POE+ standards which only used 2 twisted pairs for power.

According to the POE++ (802.3bt) specs, Cat5 cable or higher is required for power delivery up to 100 meters. The primary concern with delivering the higher current of Type 3 or Type 4 POE++ seems to be that significantly more heat is generated in the cable conductors that needs to be dissipated. This heat buildup especially becomes a problem with large cable bundles as may be used in a building or data center. As a result, there are guidelines for the maximum number of cables in a bundle when POE++ is used, and a lowering of the effective maximum ambient temperature rating of the cable by 10 degrees C / 20 degrees F.

This document has a pretty good overview of these types of issues regarding heat generation in POE cables:
https://www.hca.hitachi-cable.com/produ ... -Paper.pdf

Certain Ethernet cable constructions are better at dissipating heat than others. As you might expect, thicker gauge cables are better than thinner ones (so 22 AWG or 23 AWG conductors are better than 24 AWG) and pure copper conductors are significantly better than copper-clad aluminum. Additionally, foil shields dissipate heat, so shielded cables (STP) are better than unshielded (UTP).

So, overall choosing a higher grade (higher category) of cable like shielded Cat6a or Cat8 is likely to work better both for data bandwidth and power delivery. But obviously real world performance may not exactly match the theoretical specs.

The good news is that according to the specifications page for the Blackmagic Studio Camera 4K Pro, the power consumption when using PoE is 30‑46 W which is considerably under the 71 W maximum power delivery at the device end possible with PoE++ 802.3bt Type 4 (100W at power supply end). So hopefully this means that power delivery over longer distances is less likely to be a problem when using properly spec'd cables.

[quote="Nelson Villamil"]Hi guys

I understand that my next comment is Off Topic of this post, Sorry.
But I have a question, maybe someone knows the answer.

Why Blackmagic didn't use etherCON RJ 45 connectors for the new BM Studio Camera and Studio converter ???

EtherCON-6A.jpg

2 reasons,
1 it would cost too much
2 they don't make a PCB mount version of the cat6a ethercon

Thanks, guys! I hope BMD will have specifications and recommandations to share soon.

A little off topic : I came to the conclusion that there has to be a BMD Camera Converter in preparation, don't you think?, to also go with that BMD Studio Converter.
That would be so great! (WIth a Tally output, please!!)
Did you notice there is two Return inputs on the Studio Converter while the Studio Camera 4K Pro only has one Program Return button?
The inputs of the Studio Converter is too rich (talkback, tally, audio) to only concern a Studio Camera 4K Pro!

Did you notice there is two Return inputs on the Studio Converter while the Studio Camera 4K Pro only has one Program Return button?

Take a look again at the livestream and you will know that Grant says the 2nd Return Video will output on the HDMI output! For example to be used with a Prompter

Did you notice there is two Return inputs on the Studio Converter while the Studio Camera 4K Pro only has one Program Return button?

Take a look again at the livestream and you will know that Grant says the 2nd Return Video will output on the HDMI output! For example to be used with a Prompter

You mean SDI output ?

Did you notice there is two Return inputs on the Studio Converter while the Studio Camera 4K Pro only has one Program Return button?

Take a look again at the livestream and you will know that Grant says the 2nd Return Video will output on the HDMI output! For example to be used with a Prompter

You mean SDI output ?

Grant said the HDMI output.

Take a look again at the livestream and you will know that Grant says the 2nd Return Video will output on the HDMI output! For example to be used with a Prompter

You mean SDI output ?

Grant said the HDMI output.

Yeah, at first, it didn't make any sense to me either because I didn't realize that the only HDMI port on the Studio Camera 4K Pro was an output.
So it also means you can't connect the Pro model straight on an ATEM mini...

So it also means you can't connect the Pro model straight on an ATEM mini...

Yes you can - it's even specifically called out on the specs page



From what Grant was saying, it sounded like when connected via the ethernet connection, you can choose to output the Return 2 signal from the HDMI output on the camera head - not that that was the sole purpose of that connector.

Yes you can - it's even specifically called out on the specs page



From what Grant was saying, it sounded like when connected via the ethernet connection, you can choose to output the Return 2 signal from the HDMI output on the camera head - not that that was the sole purpose of that connector.

You're absolutely right!
Let's just say I had a massive brain fart!...

Still hoping for a 10Gb Camera Converter though...

Still hoping for a 10Gb Camera Converter though...

one of these ?
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... s/W-CST-09

one of these ?
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... s/W-CST-09

Well, actually the camera converter device that would go with it.
Like one of these:
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/fr/products/atemconverters/techspecs/W-ATC-01
but built around that 10Gb ethernet technology and that could also provide a 12V DC power to a Pocket or a DSLR, a Tally output, an XLR5 talkback headset port,...

I agree - a 10Gb POE++ equivalent of the Camera Fiber Converter would be great for the Pockets
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/uk/pro ... s/W-URSA-3

one of these ?
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... s/W-CST-09

Well, actually the camera converter device that would go with it.
Like one of these:
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/fr/products/atemconverters/techspecs/W-ATC-01
but built around that 10Gb ethernet technology and that could also provide a 12V DC power to a Pocket or a DSLR, a Tally output, an XLR5 talkback headset port,...

oh, you mean, the other end !

Grant said the HDMI output.

From what I understood , you just press Button RET1 or RET2 on the camera converter, and it will just send SDI Return 1 or SDI Return 2 to the Camera SDI OUT, whichever you selected.

I don't see how the same HDMI port could be used both as an input and and output

Grant said the HDMI output.

From what I understood , you just press Button RET1 or RET2 on the camera converter, and it will just send SDI Return 1 or SDI Return 2 to the Camera SDI OUT, whichever you selected.

I don't see how the same HDMI port could be used both as an input and and output

Uh, I know this one! It confused me too!

The HDMI port on the camera is an output and is used as an output in any case.
When a Studio Camera 4K Pro will be connected to that upcoming Blackmagic Studio Converter with an ethernet cable, the camera video will be able to output its video throw the ethernet cable, in addition to the HDMI and SDI outputs.
And what Grant said (at 1:06:28 of the edited version) is if you plug something in the RET 2 on the Blackmagic Studio Converter it will automatically output from the HDMI of the camera.
Also, in my view, the RET1 or RET2 buttons of the front of Studio Converter are just switches for the front display monitor but we'll see.

Interestingly enough, I stumbled upon Smolink good ethernet cable while looking for a replacement for my old Cat 5 console cable. The cable can support up to a maximum of 40 gigabytes of data transmission speed without any letdowns. Likewise, this 25 BASE-T network line can also support up to 20 gigahertz of bandwidth rate.