Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

Questions about ATEM Switchers, Camera Converter and everything live!
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Aug 26, 2021 12:49 am

I have been asked to assist in the integration of 4 new Studio Fiber Converters for a new customer. I have been reading some old posts here that suggested that the 25 pin D connector is not active. The posts were dated years ago, so I am hoping that someone else has some recent experience with this. BMD Tech Support was vague on the answer and at one point in my conversation wondered aloud if the 25 D connector tally had been implemented yet. :o I am applying 5 volts per the pin-out diagram for red tally, but no joy. I also asked tech support whether the tally on the converter would illuminate if the camera was not attached. No answer on that either.
Can anyone help a guy out here? I spent the better part of the AM making up some beautiful 25 D cables for intercom (4 wire...another surprise) and tally. I started connecting the tally because I thought that would be the "easy" part.

"10% of the facility build-out is the tech core, the other 90% is tally and intercom"
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline
User avatar

Xtreemtec

  • Posts: 5391
  • Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:48 am
  • Location: The Netherlands

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Aug 26, 2021 7:57 am

You need to send a Return Video SDI on RET1 to get it working. BMD Uses RET1 to run Comms and Control data such as Tally ;) As it is Embedded into the Return Video as Ancillary Data..

And Yes Intercom does work.. But very honest don't expect too much out of it.. :roll: We find it un-useable in our setup. But we do concert registrations. And the headset outputs are just not LOUD enough to hear the director.. Which is not suitable for our goal..

But for Studios that are often silent it wont be a problem..
Daniel Wittenaar .:: Xtreemtec Media Productions ::. -= www.xtreemtec.nl =-
4K OBV Trailer, ATEM TVS HD, 4M/E Broadcast Studio 4K, Constelation 8K, Hyperdeck Studio 12G, Ursa Broadcast 4K, 4K fiber converters with Sony Control
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostFri Aug 27, 2021 2:53 am

Thanks very much! I <thought> I did have SDI connected to RET 1, because we were also having genlock issues with the flavor of sync the facility has. We elected to resolve <that> problem by turning on the frame syncs on each camera input of the switcher ;) . So maybe I disconnected that cable.
So you are having luck with tallys with only regular SDI connected to RET 1 and not the ATEM SDI with the secret sauce embedded in it? If so, I'm hopeful.
I don't expect much out of the comms either. This is a 4000 seat church. I have used aircraft noise isolating headsets under similar conditions. I don't know what they have in the way of headsets. And of course, they did not know that the comms on these boxes are 4-wire only. So I have cobbled together <ONE> 4 wire to 2 wire hybrid to feed their 2 wire clear-com system. Glomming the send and receive of 4 CCUs on to one send and receive on a 2/4 converter will prove "interesting" I am sure.
BMD left a few things out of this allegedly "broadcast" quality product. Not ranting....just stating a fact. Every studio-grade camera I have installed has at least had the <option> of 2 wire comms....and no foolishness with tallys. Just hook'em up and they work.
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline
User avatar

Xtreemtec

  • Posts: 5391
  • Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 11:48 am
  • Location: The Netherlands

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostMon Aug 30, 2021 1:42 pm

I'm even suprised they included 4W on these units.. As they are very in love with there embedded intercom on SDI.. ;)

Anyway it's not the best Fiber setup i have seen for these cameras anyway but for sure the cheapest if you need Tally, Genlock and SDI + analog intercom.... :roll:

We completely switched to IP based intercom and run Ethernet + 12G-SDI on our fiber backs. That ethernet then supplies PoE to the GreenGo intercom beltpack, Much more options, 100% better audio quality.. :D
Daniel Wittenaar .:: Xtreemtec Media Productions ::. -= www.xtreemtec.nl =-
4K OBV Trailer, ATEM TVS HD, 4M/E Broadcast Studio 4K, Constelation 8K, Hyperdeck Studio 12G, Ursa Broadcast 4K, 4K fiber converters with Sony Control
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostTue Aug 31, 2021 2:21 am

Well, I took your advice and connected video to SDI 1 on all 4 fiber converters. One of them did not work even after a re-boot, but did work after disconnecting and reconnecting video. I'm still working on the 4W. The particular camera chain I started on initially showed all 4W settings grayed out. A re-boot restored them. Side tone, and near as I can tell headset and microphone level are controlled from the front panel of the CCU. But not a bit of my +4dBm 400 Hz tone ever makes it to either the prod or eng channels. No amount of fiddling with the settings for either has resulted in any success. Presently the talk back is set to 25D/tally, but I have tried all combinations. I noted that the talkback settings in the fold-out camera VF have no effect on the fiber adapter comm output. Only the CCU does.
Tally is also a trip. I'm connecting to a Ross Carbonite Ultra and its "tally common" is connected to ground. So is tally common on the BMD. Nice. Gotta add an actual relay into the mix just to isolate the two.

Mr. Extreemtec, if you ever copied down the settings that made 4W work on your system, I'd sure appreciate knowing what they are. I just have a feeling that something needs to be set internally somewhere to pass the actual AUDIO on the 4W. The CCU is in fact controlling the levels and side tone at the camera head. Any pointers appreciated.
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostTue Aug 31, 2021 4:01 am

Hello John. I can clarify a couple of things. First please ensure you have installed the latest firmware on both the Studio and Camera Converters. There have been many changes in the updates.

The system was designed to use ATEM SDI feeding input #1 on the Studio Converter.

The external tally requires the ATEM embedded tally metadata to be present in order to be modified externally. The tally should work by applying a positive voltage. The common pin is ground. You can test this with a battery

The 4 wire interface requires all 16 SDI channels to be present in order to pass the intercom audio. This interface uses +0 balanced analog audio. Your tone should work assuming the ATEM SDI is connected.

You may not get best results by connecting all 4 units together as they would normally require a separate 4 wire interface but it is an audio mixing problem that you probably understand. At least get it working with one interface to prove the concept.

If you want please offer the ATEM and camera models you are using. All this should still work with your Ross additionally.

Regards. Gary
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 01, 2021 1:52 am

Gary, thank you very much for the detailed reply. If you can bear with me for one more round, I will surely appreciate it. I have a general familiarity with ATEM switchers, but no experience with the camera product line. Responding to each of your points, I can say:
1. I absolutely will advise my customer to confirm that his firmware is the latest.
2. There is no ATEM switcher at the facility, but things improved after we connected studio program SDI to input #1 on the studio converter. (Tally works on 2 out of 4 units and I have not followed up with further troubleshooting on the two that do not work.)
3. Obviously, program video from a Ross Carbonite does not contain any ATEM embedded tally metadata, but I can say that the battery test does work with two of the units. Can you confirm that by design, the studio converter <requires> this ATEM metadata for the external 25D tally pins to work reliably?
4. Will <any> SDI signal containing 16 active embedded audio signals "activate" the external 4W pins on the 25D connector...or must it be an ATEM switcher output signal? If so, what is the lowest cost ATEM switcher that can provide such an output output signal? To be clear, we will NOT be using any talk back feature of such an ATEM switcher...we would just procure one as a necessary requirement to get the 4W pins activated on the fiber adapter. (As you can tell by this question, it is extremely important to the customer that his external 4W comms work).
5. Of course, you are absolutely correct that piling 4 cameras on to one 4W interface is a poor substitute for proper interfacing. I have pointed this out to the customer.
6. To clarify the most important factor here, there is NO ATM switcher involved at all. The customer purchased the cameras for use in an upgrade of a facility using a Ross Carbonite production switcher and Clear-Com 2W intercom system. (I have a possible solution for him to perform the 4W to 2W conversion.

In closing, if there is a white paper on this somewhere, I have yet to find it. The cameras are making lovely pictures. It is just the comms and tally issues that must be resolved. What I really need is a clear answer as to whether the Blackmagic URSA Broadcast Camera ensemble with fiber converter and studio viewfinder is capable (with current firmware) of voltage tally and 4W comms <without> a ATEM switcher involved.

You are most kind to respond so quickly. I am in a bit of a spot after telling the customer "sure..I'll interface that to your new switcher and existing comms!" so your continued involvement will be most appreciated.
JF
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 01, 2021 1:40 pm

Hello John. The latest firmware for the Studio Camera and Fiber Converters is called 1.3 which is part of the Camera firmware. This firmware was introduced in Camera firmware 6.9.6 I believe. In any event, make sure when the Camera Setup utility is run that the Fiber Converters indicate 1.3. Also note when updating the Camera Fiber Converter, it must be powered by the camera and not the SMPTE Fiber.

With this update, I believe the external tally should work with most any SDI feeding Input #1 on the Studio Fiber Converter. I think your test shows that. As you pointed out 2 of the 4 units work. We have not really seen any broken external tally functionality that was not corrected with wiring or configuration.

The External talkback for 3rd party intercoms in the DB-25 utilizes SDI channels 13-16 as you know. Any SDI that already has these channels will support this functionality. It doesn't really have to be an ATEM SDI. As camera control was designed for these cameras using the ATEM switcher, it was assumed there would be an ATEM in the chain. The least expensive ATEM for camera control is the Television Studio HD which will control up to 8 cameras. Many of these are used in conjunction with 3rd party switchers. The least expensive alternative is using the Blackmagic Shield for Arduino. One of these will have the necessary tally metadata and 16 channels of SDI audio. You would need to add an SDI Distribution Amplifier on the output to feed the inputs to the Studio Converters. You could feed the program output of your switcher to the Shield and have all the functionality. It can also be used to add tally to the cameras if you want to write a small bit of code.

Using one 4 Wire interface is not the best but it is possible to take the output and feed all four cameras assuming you can get enough gain. Probably using a one to 4 mult cable will work in that direction. Connecting all four camera microphone sends together is not proper unless you have a small 4 to one mixer. Since this is analog audio, it shouldn't be too difficult. I haven't tried this so it may be a bit tricky with the levels. There is a degree of mix minus at the camera end for this.

I hope this helps. You may feel free to PM me if you have more questions.

Regards, Gary
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Sep 02, 2021 2:43 pm

I think with one last clarification from you, I might be able to go quietly away and stop bothering you.
You said "The External talkback for 3rd party intercoms in the DB-25 utilizes SDI channels 13-16 as you know." Actually, this is my absolutely first exposure to the ATEM SDI control of camera ops, tally, intercom, etc. So please again bear with me.

Where my confusion lies is that we keep on talking about the various SDI embedded audio channels supporting comms function. I am sure you know that I want to use ONLY analog 4W off the 25D connector. So when speaking about SDI channels 13-16, do you mean that once a video signal containing the ancillary data associated with these channels appears at SDI 1 in, it will trigger an internal capability that will activate comms audio in analog format at the 25 D connector? I read your last reply once and decide that I'm good with analog at the 25D connector. When I re-read your reply a second time, I get the impression that I have to externally embed analog audio into SDI channels 13-16 to get it out to the camera and back.
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Sep 02, 2021 4:03 pm

Hello John. I did just send you a PM but for everyone's benefit I will try to explain better. The connections for 3rd party intercom at the DB-25 connector take balanced analog +0 dBu audio in and out. This audio will be embedded and de-embedded by the Studio Fiber Converter on the SDI feed to and from the camera that runs through the SMPTE Fiber. In order for this to work, the SDI feed on Input #1 of the Studio Fiber converter must already have audio channels 1-16 present as a carrier. The converter does not generate these channels if not already present. As the design assumes an ATEM SDI feed will be present for Camera Control, this will automatically work. In your case with no ATEM, you will need to use some SDI signal that has audio channels 1-16 and at the same frame rate as the camera. Note, the Shield for Arduino could be used for this purpose. I hope this helps.

Regards, Gary
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

John Fleetwood

  • Posts: 18
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:50 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostMon Sep 06, 2021 2:59 am

Gary, thanks for the PM as well as the clarification post here on the forum. I now have a much better understanding how to use this Studio Fiber Converter without employing the ATEM switcher. You have gone the extra mile to explain things, and I appreciate it.

John
John Fleetwood
President
Contract Video Specialists, Inc.
Jessup Maryland
www.contractvideo.com
Offline

mix effects

  • Posts: 45
  • Joined: Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:25 am
  • Real Name: boris salhaji

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 15, 2021 10:39 am

Hi,

I'm expriencing the same isssue.

I got new studio and camera fiber converters, up to date, the ursa as well. I can't trigger the red or green tally using the DB25

My set up is :

4 ursa with fiber and studio converter (latest firmware)
1 atem 1M/E production 4K and a third party switcher.

I want to use the atem to color correct the cams. The switching is done by the third party vision mixer wich sends tally contacts.

I try almost evrything but i certainly miss something. I connect a SDI (PGM1 of the atem) to the ret1 connector of the studio fiber, I got the tally by the atem but nothing in contacting te pin 11 and 12 of the DB25. I try with a 9V battery (always with te ret 1 connected to the PGM of the atem) between pin 11 and 12 still nothing. I try to put a SDI from another source (SMPTE bars and 1Khz ch 1&2) still nothing.

I'm totally lost. Do you have a scheme on how to connect Equipment?

Reading your post I understand that for the coms I need to put a SDI signal containing whatever sound on channel 15/16 in order the studio fiber replace it with the coms?!
Offline

Robert Schemitsch

  • Posts: 93
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:48 pm

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 15, 2021 11:02 am

Have you all set the menu on the Studio Converter for "SDI + DB25"?
Offline

mix effects

  • Posts: 45
  • Joined: Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:25 am
  • Real Name: boris salhaji

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 15, 2021 12:24 pm

Hi Robert,

thanks for you help


For the coms it works now but not the way I want. It work with an atem constellation but not with the atem 1M/E production 4K. And I understand that it does not work cause it don't send audio on chanel 15/16. does that mean that I can't use the intercom system with an atem 1M/E production 4K ???? :shock:

But I still not have the tally with the DB25 I try all the combinations yes i'm in SDI+DB25 it doesnt work in D25 either.

What I want to do is turn on the Tally by contacting on the DB25 (pin 11 12)
Offline

Robert Schemitsch

  • Posts: 93
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:48 pm

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostSat Sep 18, 2021 7:45 am

It just works in my setup.
Offline

terramarcreative

  • Posts: 1
  • Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2022 9:12 pm
  • Real Name: Mike Prince

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostFri Feb 18, 2022 9:51 pm

Does anyone have DB25 block diagram using Tally/Com cable for Studio Fiber converter. Equipment I am using is 2ME switcher, Iso Extreme for streaming, two studio fiber converters, Two G2 URSA Broadcast cameras with Fiber backs, RTS 2 wire com.

I am also looking for a wiring diagram for the DB25 connector to wire for com. to build that cable.
Offline

DLVideo

  • Posts: 4
  • Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:34 pm
  • Real Name: David Langsam

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostFri Jun 03, 2022 11:40 pm

Gary, thank you for your responses. I'm sorry this issue continues to be such a challenge. Myself (senior video engineer) and a colleague (senior audio engineer) have spent two days on this and are more than a little frustrated, please forgive me. Phone tech support has been utterly useless.

We are integrating 3 brand new G2 Ursa cameras with fiber converters with a Constellation. All firmware is current.

We are using a Clearcom 2 wire power supply and have a Clearcom IF4W4 4-channel two-to-four wire converter connected to the D25 connector on each fiber base. The pinout for the D25 in the manual is clear.

I am inputting M/E 1 to return 1 on each fiber base directly from the Constellation. I can only assume that the Constellation is generating 16 channels of embedded SDI audio.

Thus far, we have only been able to get intercom audio from the camera to the fiber base. Despite different settings, at no time have we gotten any audio from the fiber base to the camera. We have also tried just inputting analog audio instead of the audio output from the two-to-four wire converter. No audio passes from the fiber base to the camera. Also, there is no side tone at the camera.

Tally from the Constellation is triggering the camera tallys.

I understand that under the hood, you are using SDI channels 13-16 embedded audio for Rx and Tx.

Please, there must be a simple list, chart, diagram, check list or something to be able to assist in making this work. I have spent more time on intercom on this system than the entire rest of the system. I expected this would be the easy part; it's just four wire intercom.
Offline

Asgeir Hustad

  • Posts: 334
  • Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 10:13 am
  • Location: Norway

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Jun 09, 2022 7:41 am

Is return video working on your cameras? As in, can you actually see the M/E 1-signal if you press RET?

You say tally is correct, but is that tally on the Fiber-converter or on the actual camera head? If it's only on the Camera Converter, you might have a bad SDI Return-connection between the Fiber Converter and the camera.

That seems unlikely if it's the same fault for all three cameras, and it's not the case if camera control and return video is working, but worth a double check maybe?
Offline

DLVideo

  • Posts: 4
  • Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:34 pm
  • Real Name: David Langsam

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Jun 16, 2022 4:37 pm

Yes, return and tally are working properly. I hope to get back to the client shop next week and continue to trouble shoot this.
Offline

brianj1107

  • Posts: 1
  • Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2022 5:35 pm
  • Location: Carrolton, TX
  • Real Name: Brian Jones

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Dec 15, 2022 2:52 pm

Xtreemtec wrote:I'm even suprised they included 4W on these units.. As they are very in love with there embedded intercom on SDI.. ;)

Anyway it's not the best Fiber setup i have seen for these cameras anyway but for sure the cheapest if you need Tally, Genlock and SDI + analog intercom.... :roll:

We completely switched to IP based intercom and run Ethernet + 12G-SDI on our fiber backs. That ethernet then supplies PoE to the GreenGo intercom beltpack, Much more options, 100% better audio quality.. :D




Hello Xtreemtec, I work for a company and we use this BM equipment; (URSA G2, Constellation switcher, Camera SMPTE Fiber Converters and GreenGo Com), That said we have been trying to figure out how to get Com through the camera without having to buy a bunch of converters and base stations. It sounds like you have done this. Can you post a wiring diagram or list of how you have accomplished this please.

Video Specialist with ETS
Brian Jones
Brian Jones
Video Specialist @ ETS
Offline

DLVideo

  • Posts: 4
  • Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2021 9:34 pm
  • Real Name: David Langsam

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostTue May 30, 2023 9:54 pm

Sorry for the delay in updating this.

The manual is incorrect. The 4-wire intercom circuit via D25 connector does not work from the fiber base station to the camera. Curiously it does work from the camera to the base station. I would appreciate BMD engineering correct this.

The only way to make intercom work is to use the RJ45 talkback connector on the Constellation. This is only 4-wire, which is fine. You must have switcher PGM (M/E 1) connected to the camera. And there are a couple of software settings:
In the fiber base station: Talkback must be set to SDI+DB25.
In the Constellation: Talkback audio must be turned on.
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed May 31, 2023 3:56 am

The 4 wire interface in the Studio Fiber Converter DB25 correctly works when an ATEM SDI signal at the same frame rate of the camera is connected to Return 1. There could be variations to this however the SDI must have 16 channels of audio present in order to carry the external talkback signal to the camera. Then you should set the menu to DB25 and tally for this to work. If you fave further issues with this feel free to PM me as I should be able to help get it working. We have a lot of systems working in this way. I hope this helps.

Regards Gary


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

FWanders

  • Posts: 2
  • Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2023 7:04 am
  • Real Name: Fox Weitzel

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostMon Sep 18, 2023 7:28 am

Any assistance please.

I am integrating talkback from the cameras into a Bolero NSA002. The Bolero system already has a number of Rediel packs integrated and its working fine.

I have the cameras talking successfully to each other with the ENG channel. To do this I enabled talkback from the ATEM on the ENG for the Camera Inputs and I updated the Studio Camera Converter to SDI +d25.

We have CCU control from the ATEM going from an Output to SDI splitter then to RET1 of both Studio fiber converters.

The cameras can talk to each other, but when I Key the Cam channel from my Reidel belt pack I hear myself continuously. This only happens with Beltpacks that have the Cam channel set to Talk, always listen. The moment they start talking they hear themselves echoing back. The Camera operators can of course hear me, they do not hear the echo.

Basically I'm wondering if there is someway to strip my incoming audio from the outgoing audio before it loops back into the base station. And I'd there are any obvious issues in my configuration please let me know. I have never integrated talkback before and really want to figure out what I'm doing wrong.
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostTue Sep 19, 2023 9:20 pm

Hello Fox. Which ATEM do you have and how exactly (what to what) is your 4 wire interface connected? How many cameras and Studio Fiber Converters are you using?

Gary
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

FWanders

  • Posts: 2
  • Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2023 7:04 am
  • Real Name: Fox Weitzel

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostWed Sep 20, 2023 1:16 am

Gary Adams wrote:Hello Fox. Which ATEM do you have and how exactly (what to what) is your 4 wire interface connected? How many cameras and Studio Fiber Converters are you using?

Gary



Gary,

I have a ATEM 2 M/E Constellation HD and 2 BMD Ursa G2s on Studio Fiber Converters. From both Converters I have built d25 to XLR breakouts and wired the ENG channel to the XLRs according to the pinout diagram I found in the manual.

That being XLRf to Pin 1,2, Ground on 3rd Pin, and XLRm to 4,5 and again ground on 3rd.

From the d25 breakouts I used XLR splitters to bridge the breakouts, then I ran 2 XLRs to the Riedel NSA002, plugged them into In-1 and Out-1 (Respectively) and configured the NSA002 to use the in/out as a 4-wire channel.

The ATEM and Fiber Studio Converters having the following configuration; Within the ATEM configuration CCU has been set to OUTPUT 3, OUTPUT 3 has been run to and SDI splitter (it is not a BMD splitter btw) and the OUTS from the splitter have been run into RET1 of both Studio Fiber Converters.
Also within the ATEM - Talkback has been enabled on ENG channels but muted on all SDI except the two cameras I want integrated.

Just looking at the Fiber Studio Converters - the configuration for Talkback is set to SDI+D25.

If I turn off talkback on the ATEM I can set it up so the Cams and I have a one-to-one channel, but not partyline. Obviously less than ideal :|

Let me know if you need any other details :D
Offline

Robert Schemitsch

  • Posts: 93
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:48 pm

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Sep 21, 2023 9:17 am

It seems that - with the intergrated Atem 4wire interface - the 4wire input is also present on the 4wire output. It makes sense if the 4wire output is the deembedded channels 13-16 from the SDI outputs, where all incoming signals (camera 13-16 and 4-wire) are embedded for talkback.

Gary, maybe can you give us a schematic view of the 4wire routing of the constellation switchers, as I experience the same probleme with a 4-wire intercom connected? I solved it with an Audio to SDI embedder on a dedicated return feed to the cameras.
Offline

Gary Adams

Blackmagic Design

  • Posts: 1384
  • Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:14 am

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostThu Sep 21, 2023 4:34 pm

Fox. Thanks for the detailed description. That helps with the response. Sorry If I write too much but this area is more complicated and has variations in how it could be utilized. And there are "if" statements making multiple different answers to the same question.

You have all the right gear, so I'll try to offer a usable setup. First, both Constellation and Studio Fiber Converters on the cameras have a 4 wire interface. Any 4 Wire interface must be uniquely connected to the 3rd party intercom for a proper interface. It won't work well to "mult" multiple 4 wire interfaces as you are dealing with multing microphones which doesn't work well.

The first "if" is whether you want to use the talkback headset on the Constellation. If you do, then it's best to simply connect your 4 wire interface to the Constellation and "not" connect to the cameras. The system was not designed to use both interfaces on switcher and separately on cameras. In this case, connect to the Constellation and let the ATEM distribute talkback to the cameras with the "SDI and DB25" setting along with enabling the channels in the setup. The ATEM and Cameras will be their own partyline connected to your system. That will work without any feedback as the Constellation provides a mix minus to the 3rd party system.

If you do not need the Constellation talkback and wish to have separate connection to the cameras, then connect 2 separate 4 wire interfaces, one to each camera at the Studio Fiber Converter. Set the converter to "Intercom Tally and DB25". This will leave the ATEM out of the mix and you will have separate communication to each camera if your system allows. This will eliminate any feedback as the Studio Fiber converter has Mix minus to the 3rd pary system. Note if the Studio Fiber converter is set to SDI and DB25 there will be feedback because of the nature of the design. So it is really one or the other but not both.

If you have three 4 wire interfaces and wish to use Constellation and cameras all separate on the 3rd party system then turn off the talkback on the ATEM as well as setting the Studio Fiber converter to Intercom tally and DB25. This will provide 3 separate channels.

If you only have one 4 wire interface, then the best option is to connect it to the Constellation and enable the channels and set SDI and DB25. Do not connect to the cameras as they will all be interconnected through the ATEM.

This can all work correctly but I suspect there would be questions due to the complexity. Feel free to PM me if you wish. I'll try to monitor this as well. I hope this helps. Sorry about the long read.

Gary
Gary Adams
Blackmagic Design
Offline

baikonoore

  • Posts: 1
  • Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2023 9:31 am
  • Real Name: Roman Faskhutdinov

Re: Studio Fiber Converter 25 D connector tally/coms

PostFri Nov 10, 2023 9:46 pm

Hi!
To work db25 tally BMD studio fiber converter with Ross Carbonite Ultra, I made the following circuit
Image

Return to Live Production

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 57 guests