Pyxis 12K

My concern about the L mount is having an adapter for my EF lens may affect AF tracking performance.

Update:

Waite, Did someone say the AF tracking will only work with L mount?

It's an unknown at this point. The adapter will simply present itself as an unknown L-Mount lens and then do the translation from L to whatever lens you are adapting to.

That slight clarification is promising to read, but seems unlikely-to-be-unknown: must've been tried by now, given the baseline configurations of Blackmagic bodies with Sigma MC-21 adapters by the bazillions.

I'm wondering what the hit to dynamic range will be if the camera is line skipping instead of downsampling.

Hook will post it later in the thread where we list all the RS times

Updated.

The Pyxis 12k at 12k the read speed is still slightly faster than the BMCC6k/Pyxis 6k at 6k

The sensor speeds show part of the greatness of the UMP 12K which has:
8k 17:9 (full FOV super35) 7.78ms
6k Super16 7.78ms
and
4k Super16 3.89ms with a nice 240 fps

The FF Cine 12K sensor does have 2 stops more dynamic range and the qualities of a larger sensor, but the super35 UMP 12K sensor is no slouch and has advantages for longer reach of longer lenses. I think there is a good place for both of these sensor densities. However, it will be a tough choice between the Cine 12K and the Pyxis 12K as each has advantages and disadvantages.

just preordered the l mount version now.. Shipping starts July if I recall correctly?

... I think there is a good place for both of these sensor densities. However, it will be a tough choice between the Cine 12K and the Pyxis 12K as each has advantages and disadvantages.

And you could add the UMProG2 to the decision as well. It’s going to be up to each person to decide what they need the most. Some, like Tim, may have a Camera A and Camera B combination to consider. Some will go with any economy they can find while others will want maximum functionality and then there’s the pursuit of the best image where ‘best’ isn’t an absolute but relative to each person’s goals and judgment.

In a way I’m content that I can’t pull the trigger in the heat of the moment. I jumped on the URSA Mini 4.6 K but I waited a bit to decide on the BMPCC4K. This time I must wait until the dust settles before I commit as I must also decide on the best approach to lens whichever camera I order.

BMD did seem to partner with Fujinon for the zoom lens bundled with the URSA Broadcast G2. And then there’s the Fujinon MK zoom pair for mFT that might have been a partnership too.

I can’t believe I’m the only person in the world that needs a multi-purpose uncompromising single zoom that doesn’t exist for under $10K. Maybe my lens conundrum has someone at BMD talking to someone at Fujinon this week to create an ideal single wide-to-telephoto constant aperture parfocal zoom in the smartest mount to marry with the Cine12K and Pyxis 12K. But that lens won’t show up until NAB2026! I could live with that. I’m a patient old fellow wondering which will I’ll see first: heaven or a heavenly zoom.

... I think there is a good place for both of these sensor densities. However, it will be a tough choice between the Cine 12K and the Pyxis 12K as each has advantages and disadvantages.

And you could add the UMProG2 to the decision as well. It’s going to be up to each person to decide what they need the most. Some, like Tim, may have a Camera A and Camera B combination to consider. Some will go with any economy they can find while others will want maximum functionality and then there’s the pursuit of the best image where ‘best’ isn’t an absolute but relative to each person’s goals and judgment.

In a way I’m content that I can’t pull the trigger in the heat of the moment. I jumped on the URSA Mini 4.6 K but I waited a bit to decide on the BMPCC4K. This time I must wait until the dust settles before I commit as I must also decide on the best approach to lens whichever camera I order.

BMD did seem to partner with Fujinon for the zoom lens bundled with the URSA Broadcast G2. And then there’s the Fujinon MK zoom pair for mFT that might have been a partnership too.

I can’t believe I’m the only person in the world that needs a multi-purpose uncompromising single zoom that doesn’t exist for under $10K. Maybe my lens conundrum has someone at BMD talking to someone at Fujinon this week to create an ideal single wide-to-telephoto constant aperture parfocal zoom in the smartest mount to marry with the Cine12K and Pyxis 12K. But that lens won’t show up until NAB2026! I could live with that. I’m a patient old fellow wondering which will I’ll see first: heaven or a heavenly zoom.

you can get a used Ursa Mini Pro G2 for like $2200 now. If the sensor is solid, it will last for a while.
I sold my G2 to my old work years ago, and I recently asked how it's running. They have been using it almost daily for 3 years straight, on top of me using it for nearly 2 years prior. It's more of a testament to the Ursa Mini body.

I REALLY hope they would do one more iteration of the Ursa Mini Pro body with the 12k LF sensor. It could sit right between the Pyxis 12k and the Cine 12k with price and features. Having 2 SDI Ports is really really nice, and I'm fighting the urge to get a Pyxis 12k because I'm wanting an extra out, haha.

just preordered the l mount version now.. Shipping starts July if I recall correctly?

Good for you, Andreas! July has been a placeholder term for BMD since forever. Sometimes July means July. Sometimes it means September. but it will come and you’ll be one of the first of many thousands to enjoy this fantastic box camera.

BMD should have got the rights from Eastman Kodak to call the Pyxis 12K a Brownie; that was the first disruptive box (still) camera that everyone had to have 125 years ago. May the Pyxis 12K bask in the light of innovation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodak_Bro ... rov=sfti1#

On a somewhat related note, what is the recommended method to run v mount batteries instead of the bpu for the Pyxis 12k?

On a somewhat related note, what is the recommended method to run v mount batteries instead of the bpu for the Pyxis 12k?

There are a variety of battery plates out there that plug into the DC socket to power the camera. Most of the plates need to be mounted either via rods or some other method. Tilta makes one that attaches in the built-in battery slot. I'd be a little concerned about stressing that connection too much, though. It looks like that particular one has a second attachment point (that may only work with their cage or something).

… I REALLY hope they would do one more iteration of the Ursa Mini Pro body with the 12k LF sensor. It could sit right between the Pyxis 12k and the Cine 12k with price and features. Having 2 SDI Ports is really really nice, and I'm fighting the urge to get a Pyxis 12k because I'm wanting an extra out, haha.

I agree the 2 XLR are very useful on the URSA Mini 4.6K and I miss them on that cramped configuration of the BMPCC4K and now i’ll miss them on the Pyxis 12K.

But in the spirit of inheriting a bunch of lemons so you decide to make lemonade, the Sound Devices MixPre-6 II has four full-size XLR In ports and it is made to be mounted under your camera if you need to be a mobile sole operator.

On a somewhat related note, what is the recommended method to run v mount batteries instead of the bpu for the Pyxis 12k?

Tilta Cage has a nice solution: https://tilta.com/shop/camera-cage-for- ... k-pro-kit/
Details on specific Battery Plate: https://tilta.com/shop/battery-plate-fo ... -pyxis-6k/

While not as good as having bult-in xlr, you can always do something like this...

https://www.mid49.com/products/audio-breakout-ab-9-blackmagic-pyxis?srsltid=AfmBOoqXU20PaqWUC4FGSm-OnxIFN9l1y0d5c2p4jPBj5p1mZ_pQW8t7

Thanks, Joey; that’s a lot more practical for the Pyxis than my tongue-in-cheek solution to add XLR ports.

A second XLR would certainly be nice, but it's very clear now that the Pyxis is what it is and for just a little bit more you can have a camera that has the best of everything in the Ursa Cine. It's almost more a decision now about what size and weight do you need, than how much can you afford. And there's still the 6k Pyxis for those on a stricter budget.

Their product line is fairly similar to the RED line now, except the Pyxis 12k is cheaper than the Komodo-X and the Ursa Cine is way cheaper than the Raptor-X (but also bigger and heavier which may matter to some).

On a somewhat related note, what is the recommended method to run v mount batteries instead of the bpu for the Pyxis 12k?

As I was hoping (most likely will) to get the Pyxis 12k as a 'forever camera'-- I say that thinking it would last 5-ish years... I was going to go all out with accessories.

The Mid49 stuff seems to be the most solid, intuitive cage/rigging system along with their battery plate.
All in all, it would be like $2000 to rig it up 'properly', but you can also get by with just a Nitze Rail V Mount solution with a pair of D-Tap outs and a USB-C port.

FYI, I've been using the USB-C out on the back of the Pyxis to power my Tascam FR-AV2 to great success. I ALWAYS run media when recording, so having a free USB-C outlet to power accessories is really nice!

I was actually looking at the tilta - love how clean it is and that it can be attached directly and then secured via the cage

Anyone have any experience with this battery adapter personally?

I say that they should do a new URSA Mini 12K. In between the URSA Cine and PYXIS. 4" Flip Out LCD with Status Display on backside. 2X CFExpress Card Slots inside that Flip Out LCD area. Just like the 4" Flip Out on the UMP models. V-Mount or Gold Mount Battery Plate options. Fixed PL /i Technology or Locking EF Mount. Internal ND. No AC Side LCD, but instead mounting plate options. USB-C EVF, and 7-Pin Lemo at front. SDI Out, Timecode BNC, Ethernet, 2-Pin Lemo Power, etc. Cross between URSA Mini and PYXIS ports basically.

Overall smaller than the UMP by getting rid of buttons and dials on outside. So body isn't as long. But it is a bit bigger and heavier than PYXIS. Same frame rates as PYXIS 12K.

That would make for a good option for those of us looking for something just in between.

URSA Mini because they can reuse the name, and adding 12K indicates what model it is. No need for Pro designation anymore. Just URSA Mini 12K.

URSA Cine 12K, URSA Mini 12K, and PYXIS 12K as the 3 options with the same sensor.

So is the UMP12K S35 obsolete now? At $6300 it's a hard sell...

It is certainly advantageous to those who shoot with Super35 lenses. That can be a big deal to try to replace your lens sets with full-frame lenses, especially zooms.

The image quality is still very good too, but no longer the best BMD has to offer. $7K for a Cine 12K LF Body and $5K for the Pyxis 12K with the UMPro12K in-between. We shall see if BMD keeps selling it this year.

A price cut would be nice, for the UMP12K, that is. The RS times for the Pyxis 12K have left me a bit disappointed. I could shoot 8K, but why under-utilize the sensor?

A price cut would be nice, for the UMP12K, that is. The RS times for the Pyxis 12K have left me a bit disappointed. I could shoot 8K, but why under-utilize the sensor?

Sensor still performs amazingly at 8K and 4K. And, you save in storage costs. I’m very pleased with the footage I’ve shot in 8K on the UC12K.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

8K recording from the 12K field of view retains the cinematic enhancement of separating foreground from background which can enhance your 8K images compared to the UMPro12K at 12K. I don’t plan on recording 12K. I’d record 8K with primes or the windowed 9K with zooms.

[Cine 12K] Sensor still performs amazingly at 8K and 4K. And, you save in storage costs…

So glad we have your experience with the Cine12K. Saving storage with 4K recording can be an important consideration for me when shooting for several hours a day!

When I have the Pyxis 12K, I’d plan to test all codecs on the same complex scene to be able to discern the differences as possible using the constant quality settings as I did years ago showing myself I could see differences in direct comparisons that may not be noticeable in a real video where you obviously only see one codec and that can seem ‘visually lossless.’ I’d post those comparisons on Vimeo as viewable by the public.

What's the initial consensus of what the battery life will be vs the Pyxis 6k?

A price cut would be nice, for the UMP12K, that is. The RS times for the Pyxis 12K have left me a bit disappointed. I could shoot 8K, but why under-utilize the sensor?

Sensor still performs amazingly at 8K and 4K. And, you save in storage costs. I’m very pleased with the footage I’ve shot in 8K on the UC12K.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Great to hear Tim!

I would love to hear more about shooting in 4k specifically if you don’t mind / are able to

On a somewhat related note, what is the recommended method to run v mount batteries instead of the bpu for the Pyxis 12k?

The Mid49 stuff seems to be the most solid, intuitive cage/rigging system along with their battery plate.
All in all, it would be like $2000 to rig it up 'properly', but you can also get by with just a Nitze Rail V Mount solution with a pair of D-Tap outs and a USB-C port.

I love the Mid49 DB-9 plate as well but I just find the price a bit hard to justify.. Do you think they will come down in price? I feel like I could rig up something similar with the Tilta TA-BTP4-V-B Tilta Mini PD and a Smallrig Rod clamp, although it wouldnt have the fuse and trigger functionality of course (which I don't really need). I wish there was something in between that awfully long Tilta Pyxis V-Mount adapter and the super nice although a bit over the top Mid49 plate..

I'm not sure if this is the wrong thread to ask but I didn't want to make a new one. Is there a reason for pricing disparity within the EU countries trading in euros. France and Germany have different prices for Pyxis 12k, I can see a small asterisk but can't find the info. thanks

Mid49 is expensive something about made in America, you need 500% tariffs to make made in China just as expensive.

By the way where are people pre-ordering this? Any EU sellers already have them listed with a shipping estimate?

Mid49 is expensive something about made in America, you need 500% tariffs to make made in China just as expensive.

Tariffs are probably becoming a thing to take note of in purchase decisions of accessories. I should ask Shape if they have something cooking for a Pyxis BPU to V-mount battery adapter as Shape is Canadian.

Yeah. 12k Pyxis with 16 steps of Dynamic Range? RED... Shots FIRED!

I will be getting this camera.

I have a couple of Panasonic lenses and a full array of L mount lenses for them. Full frame. I also have a L to PL mount adapter for my Cinema lenses... that is the beauty of a L mount investment-it can be adapted to almost any lens system and can now use the BM auto focus system. I love it when I don't have to take a beating on selling lenses that I love.

I also happen to have the Full Frame Cinema Camera 6k and would love to know where I can get this beta software as I have had this camera on a 8.7 beta for over a year. It's nice to be a part of the cool kid club again. Any links? I only see 9.3.1 on the support site.

There should be a beta release within a few days.

Curious if P12K can shoot 6fps in HFR mode. I understand the UC12k only goes down to 10FPS.

I'm dying to see footage from the Pyxis 12K. I'm worried that it will have the weird stuttering motion cadence that the Pyxis 6K has. I owned the Pyxis 6K but the motion not matter the codec, was very unpleasant to my eyes. Something just doesn't look right with it, perhaps it's the slow readout, but I ended up selling it. From the limited footage I've seen from the Cine 12K, the motion seems good, but now that they've announced the readout is different, then I will wait until footage comes out before I preorder. Looks promising, and if they can give it continuous AF... wow.

Will, in what frame rate were you recording the footage? What frame rate was your monitor or projector used for viewing the footage?

Will, in what frame rate were you recording the footage? What frame rate was your monitor or projector used for viewing the footage?

Thanks for trying to help Rick, but I'm afraid it's not a setting or my monitors. I was filming at 24fps. Go on YouTube and look at every Pyxis video. There is something off with the motion. It's unpleasant and looks off to my eye.

Check out this video below that was tagged on Instagram as being shot on Pyxis. I did not shoot it. I messaged the DP and he confirmed it was shot on Pyxis and that he shot in 8:1. Although the commercial is excellent, looks amazing, and very is very well done, there is something off to the motion. This is what I noticed in my footage. Look at how people move, especially when the guy walks up to his wife in the kitchen. I only shot in ProRes (since they got rid of CDNG) with all my previous Blackmagic cameras and Pyxis was my first only BRAW camera. Perhaps it's not the camera and its BRAW, because I noticed a similar motion with the Ursa Mini 12K older camera.

What I was alluding to is that there might be an inconsistency in the recording frame rate and the viewing frame rate and it could even vary from how the viewer’s monitor handles the potential discrepancy. I hope I’m going in the right direction with this but I’m no expert at this stuff.

If you’re in a PAL region chances are you are recording video and broadcasting it in 25 fps or an integer multiple of that such as 50 fps or 100 frames per second. That’s going to playback just fine.

In a NTSC region, I record in 30 fps and playback on 60 fps or 120 fps devices. Again everything is normally fine because the viewing device is an integer multiple of the recording rate.

Cinema has been recorded at 24 fps and viewed in theatres at 24 fps. No problem. But most of us are viewing video recorded at 24 fps (non-interlaced) on devices that display the images at 60 or 120 fps 120 / 24 =5 and no problem. But 60 / 24 =2.5 which can’t happen on a device that uses progressive frames like your monitor. Refer to Wikipedia Telecine article and scroll down to 2:3 pull down for the techniques used on NTSC television to accommodate projection using fields instead of progressive frames:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telecine?wprov=sfti1

Here is another example below of the motion cadence of the Pyxis, by a different DP. Again, I didn't shoot it and I think that it's funny and it is well shot and looks great. But the motion is a little off... to my eye. Maybe it's my brain, and what I see as odd from Pyxis is unique to me. This motion cadence issue I see is the same no matter what monitor or TV I watch the video on. I don't see this motion issue from any of my other cameras. Never saw it when filming on ProRes on old Pocket 6K or my Ursa Mini 4,6K I used to own.

Autofocus Update Live: https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/suppor ... 9b7f119109

Blackmagic just raised the price in the US to $6,595 due to tariffs.

Still a fair price IMO. But increasing prices across the board will make many people’s lives difficult. Trump is a piece of **** and I hope he gets what he deserves.

Blackmagic just raised the price in the US to $6,595 due to tariffs.

Still a fair price IMO. But increasing prices across the board will make many people’s lives difficult. Trump is a piece of **** and I hope he gets what he deserves.

Indonesia hit with 32% tarrifs that is were the price hike comes in. How can you trust someone with gambling away the national economy as if it was a card game who manages to bankrupt his own business 4 times. More like make America Poor Again.

Blackmagic just raised the price in the US to $6,595 due to tariffs.

Still a fair price IMO. But increasing prices across the board will make many people’s lives difficult. Trump is a piece of **** and I hope he gets what he deserves.

No announcement or press release, or one coming soon?

It's a bit amusing, considering the MSRP was unveiled just yesterday...

Yeah. 12k Pyxis with 16 steps of Dynamic Range? RED... Shots FIRED!

This is going to create a very interesting situation, because Red is the only camera company that serves high end cinema and is US based... but a lot of Red's manufacturing is based in Mexico.

The Komodo is now more affordable than a Pyxis 12K, especially for US residents.

Interestingly though, in Vancouver Red is almost exclusively limited to indie production -- even the Hallmarks use Venice cameras. Productions that aren't using Venice use Alexas, or Venice's little siblings the FX3/6/9.

That said, nothing can compete with BMD's YRGB sensor + BMD's color science outside of the Alexa Mini s and Venices in terms of color rendition and dynamic range.

I will be getting this camera.

When I can afford it, I'm probably going to sell of my Komodo kit for one of these. That hopefully (fingers crossed) will be this summer

Blackmagic just raised the price in the US to $6,595 due to tariffs.

Still a fair price IMO. But increasing prices across the board will make many people’s lives difficult. Trump is a piece of **** and I hope he gets what he deserves.

It is still a bargain, but it's incorrect to say that BMD raised its price and more accurate to say that the current presidolt did that.

It was not BMD's choice, and BMD has no power over it, and BMD's price did not actually change -- that extra tax does not go to BMD.

Power draw is 60-80W according to the CineD interview. Does anyone offhand know the Pyxis 6K and/or Ursa Cine power draw?

Yeah. 12k Pyxis with 16 steps of Dynamic Range? RED... Shots FIRED!

This is going to create a very interesting situation, because Red is the only camera company that serves high end cinema and is US based... but a lot of Red's manufacturing is based in Mexico.

All of the INPUT components for a RED camera will have a tariff applied. At best a RED camera is assembled in the US.

And a great case study. What is the competitive advantage that this gives RED? A false protection against fair competition? How does this help RED innovate and be more competitive than they are now? Artificially shielding them from price competition in their home market?

JB

I was on the phone with B&H this morning about to place an order for the Pyxis 12, when all of sudden the salesman (who suggested I go with the L mount and an adapter) says - hey wait a minute they just changed the price to $6600.

So between the now higher cost and my investments in the toilet (and about to get worse on Monday) and a 60% forecast of a recession, I'm now not buying anything unless the new client I just pitched comes in.

Make America Greece Again!

All of the INPUT components for a RED camera will have a tariff applied. At best a RED camera is assembled in the US.

A lot of Red's cameras are assembled in Mexico now. Where the parts come from I don't know, but I expect most of them aren't sourced from the US. Unless Red's sensor partner is Tower Semi, it's not even getting its sensors domestically.

And a great case study. What is the competitive advantage that this gives RED? A false protection against fair competition? How does this help RED innovate and be more competitive than they are now? Artificially shielding them from price competition in their home market?

JB

Given how chaotic, random, and nonsensical the tariffs are, it's anybody's guess. I also have no idea how the fact that Red is now owned by Nikon will play into it. I wouldn't be surprised if Nikon just pulled the whole thing out of Burbank at this point in order to protect its own business. That would be drastic, but so is what the US federal government is doing to its own economy.

Does the 12K Sensor has some PDAF tech behind it ? Could AF be managed ?
That's a question that doesn't have a clear answer from cineD interview at NAB.

Regarding the only one USB-C on the front, can't a USB-C Y cable with a switcher drived by the camera (or at least a button on the cable) be used to power either the monitor or the EVF ? Does the EVF has a presence captor on it ? Well you guess the idea, that could be a quick and easy fix.