shipping when?

I heard back from AvAlive and I was told the shoulder mount WILL be the Blackmagic one. Now Im hoping its the full kit, not just the shoulder mount. Have to be specific with these things.

I don't think they offer it separately, do they?

Will bandh let me know what number I ma on the waiting list if I call them? Have had poor experiences with their CS in the past and want to make sure.

Also, do we know how many cameras are being shipped in the first batch? (obviously not, but I thought I'd ask...)

How long will it take for the entire backlog to be filled? Are we going to see 4.6k cameras going for $10k on ebay?

I just called AvAlive after seeing this post about the shoulder kit coming free to check on if it was Blackmagic's along with what number I would be in line if I pre ordered now. I currently have a pre order around 200th with B&H so I was considering switching for the free shoulder kit even though I already have a Zacuto VCT set up (free always makes sense right?). So a man picked up, I said I had a couple questions about the 4.6k URSA Mini and he said "alright". I then asked if the shoulder kit it is shipped with is the Blackmagic Design shoulder rig and in a quite rude manor he said, "Yes and if you're the guy who keeps emailing me I've already said that." I then informed him that I have never sent an email. He then said that recently they've been getting hundreds of orders and basically implied that pre ordering with them would lead to a very long wait time. After that he said he would personally go with the FS7. To wrap up this story, I don't trust a company willing to treat a customer that way, especially not even knowing that the customer they were rude to is the reason they were upset. I'll keep my pre order at B&H and continue using them for my equipment needs.

Will bandh let me know what number I ma on the waiting list if I call them? Have had poor experiences with their CS in the past and want to make sure.

Also, do we know how many cameras are being shipped in the first batch? (obviously not, but I thought I'd ask...)

How long will it take for the entire backlog to be filled? Are we going to see 4.6k cameras going for $10k on ebay?

Back when I very first called B&H months ago they informed me that I was in the under 200 club and at that time they had over 200 cameras ordered (I pre ordered in June). The last couple times I have called to see where I was in line as far as people dropping out in front of me has led to a dead end. They won't tell you where you are in line and say that they can't pull up that information.

Ok, finally found out from AvAlive that the shoulder kit being sold with the URSA Mini is NOT the Ursa Mini Shoulder Mount kit. It is the shoulder mount kit for the regular sized URSA ( part#CINECAMURSASHMK) that is being sold with the Mini, and NOT the Ursa Mini Shoulder Mount kit.

Here is the URSA Shoulder Mount kit being sold with the Mini 4.6K:



But this is the Shoulder Mount Kit designed for the URSA Mini:

I do not think the URSA shoulder mount kit will fit the Mini, will it? At any rate, not a good match.

I just used the URSA 4k for the first time on a shoot last week where we often switched from sticks to shoulder and even though we have the shoulder kit with us it is so poorly designed we just through a cloth on our shoulder and ran the URSA like that!

I just used the URSA 4k for the first time on a shoot last week where we often switched from sticks to shoulder and even though we have the shoulder kit with us it is so poorly designed we just through a cloth on our shoulder and ran the URSA like that!

On a feature operating a Red One I got so tired of my sore shoulder from the doveplate that I took my shirt off, rolled it up and just worked like that. Hot, breeze-less Texas July, too, so that was nice. Anyway, next day, the gaffer/key grip had made me up a shoulder pad made of duvey and gaffe tape. Those guys are saints

I do not think the URSA shoulder mount kit will fit the Mini, will it? At any rate, not a good match.

No. Ursa Shoulder Pad will not work on Ursa Mini.

Back when I very first called B&H months ago they informed me that I was in the under 200 club and at that time they had over 200 cameras ordered (I pre ordered in June). The last couple times I have called to see where I was in line as far as people dropping out in front of me has led to a dead end. They won't tell you where you are in line and say that they can't pull up that information.

They probably have sooooo many preorders that they don't want to tell you out of fear you'll go somewhere else. I'd stay with B&H. Their customer service is terrific (read: I've never had a problem woth them in the 10+ years I've done business with them). It's pretty much the only place I go to buy expensive production gear.

I just called AvAlive after seeing this post about the shoulder kit coming free to check on if it was Blackmagic's along with what number I would be in line if I pre ordered now. I currently have a pre order around 200th with B&H so I was considering switching for the free shoulder kit even though I already have a Zacuto VCT set up (free always makes sense right?). So a man picked up, I said I had a couple questions about the 4.6k URSA Mini and he said "alright". I then asked if the shoulder kit it is shipped with is the Blackmagic Design shoulder rig and in a quite rude manor he said, "Yes and if you're the guy who keeps emailing me I've already said that." I then informed him that I have never sent an email. He then said that recently they've been getting hundreds of orders and basically implied that pre ordering with them would lead to a very long wait time. After that he said he would personally go with the FS7. To wrap up this story, I don't trust a company willing to treat a customer that way, especially not even knowing that the customer they were rude to is the reason they were upset. I'll keep my pre order at B&H and continue using them for my equipment needs.

Ha. Maybe he was talking about me. I've emailed him a few times back and forth about this today. I wasn't rude or anything though. But I finally found out the mount he's selling is not the one for the Ursa Mini, and apparently it won't even work on the mini. So if they have received hundreds of orders because all these people are thinking their getting the Ursa Mini shoulder mount kit, the customers are going to be upset with the company when they get their regular URSA shoulder mounts, and if they find out sooner, AvAlive may lose a lot of those orders.

I heard back from AvAlive and I was told the shoulder mount WILL be the Blackmagic one. Now Im hoping its the full kit, not just the shoulder mount. Have to be specific with these things.

Get in line for Ursa Mini 4.6K and get the Ursa Mini Shoulder Mount Kit for free? THIS would be a reason to pre-order.

I was told by the reseller that I purchased from that they would honor this same deal. So, pretty happy about that.

I'd suggest to anyone that has pre-ordered from any other reseller to notify them of this and see if they're willing to match it.
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Chris

I found out AvAlive is selling the shoulder mount for the URSA camera, not the mount for the Ursa Mini. So if your supplier is honoring the same deal, I wonder if they are including the mount for the URSA camera like AvAlive or are they actually including the kit for the Ursa Mini?

Wow, I'm really excited about my 4.6k coming soon, but my patience is wearing thin as well. We have multiple big productions coming down the pipe, and I'm not spending more money on rental.

I've noticed a lot of folks canceling their orders lately. I really hope BM takes note as well. I'm not a business guru by any means, but this doesn't seem to be helping there rep much.

Until then, I've got my batteries charged and Davinci fired up.

I was told by the reseller that I purchased from that they would honor this same deal. So, pretty happy about that.

I'd suggest to anyone that has pre-ordered from any other reseller to notify them of this and see if they're willing to match it.
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Chris

I found out AvAlive is selling the shoulder mount for the URSA camera, not the mount for the Ursa Mini. So if your supplier is honoring the same deal, I wonder if they are including the mount for the URSA camera like AvAlive or are they actually including the kit for the Ursa Mini?

Ha... that seems pretty odd that they'd include a shoulder mount that doesn't even work with the camera they're including it with... especially since there's not even much of a price difference. Perhaps they don't know that it doesn't work? I'm hoping that my reseller is assuming that it's the mini version.
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c

just spoke to the company where I ordered my camera from, to see if they would match this deal. they called black magic directly, and asked if they can do this, and BMD told them that it is not a deal they are aware of, and that apparently it is in violation of BMD's policy. quite strange


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I certainly don't know the specifics of language restricting dealers, but I think a lot of the promotions we see at a vendor's site are actually arranged with the manufacturer and it's the manufacturer taking the financial hit, not the vendor who would like you to think their price is special. I'm saying there may be minor differences from retailer to retailer but the large savings with bundles of equipment from a single manufacturer are likely coming from the manufacturer. Of course BMD wouldn't authorize any promotion of incompatible components. The URSA Mini shoulder mount is intended to be used on the URSA Mini.

I wonder if the irritable person on the phone call to confirm the details was feeling the pressure knowing what they were doing was unauthorized.


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I figure the vendor buys the product from Blackmagic, BMD ships the product to the vendor completely paid for. Any dealings between the vendor and the end customer has nothing to do with BMD. That's how I think it works, anyway.

I tried calling about 15-20 retailers today in the Northeast and none of them had the Ursa Mini in stock unfortunately.

I guess I'm staying with B&H Pre-Order for now.

I figure the vendor buys the product from Blackmagic, BMD ships the product to the vendor completely paid for. Any dealings between the vendor and the end customer has nothing to do with BMD. That's how I think it works, anyway.

If the reseller wants to take a cut out of their own margin to give something away on a sale, you'd think that is completely up to the reseller.

However, many manufacturers have MAP pricing and guidelines that they require authorized resellers to stick to in order to keep the playing field level across their distribution channels. Otherwise, the larger companies could sweeten the deal more since they typically have more buying power, leading to price wars which would leave the smaller guys with narrower margins in the dust. A lot of times though, that only applies to "advertised" pricing/offers.
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c

I figure the vendor buys the product from Blackmagic, BMD ships the product to the vendor completely paid for. Any dealings between the vendor and the end customer has nothing to do with BMD. That's how I think it works, anyway.

If the reseller wants to take a cut out of their own margin to give something away on a sale, you'd think that is completely up to the reseller.

However, many manufacturers have MAP pricing and guidelines that they require authorized resellers to stick to in order to keep the playing field level across their distribution channels. Otherwise, the larger companies could sweeten the deal more since they typically have more buying power, and leave the smaller guys in the dust.
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c

that's exactly what the person I spoke to said; that including a shoulder mount is in violation of the MAP policies of BMD


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Starting to sound shady.

Starting to sound shady.

Yes. I canceled my order with them.

You're the vendor.

You see "Blackmagic Ursa" on products and you figure they're all compatible. If you don't realize there are several different cameras, Ursa Mini Shoulder Mount Kit will not work on Ursa, Ursa Viewfinder will not work on Ursa Mini without Ursa mini Shoulder Kit installed, Ursa has the ability to upgrade its turret to EF, Ursa Mini EF can not switch its mount, however Ursa Mini PL can, et cetra, then how are you going to know that Ursa Shoulder Pad will not work on Ursa Mini, nor does it apparently work very well on Ursa...so you've been overstocked for a year and, since it's not too expensive, maybe you can give some away if it'll drive more customers to your website...

Even if this practice is perfectly acceptable by the deal you have with the factory, the simple fact that you don't know enough about the product you sell raises enough flags with me. And since I'm not standing in your store, it's alot easier to roll my eyes and click to a new website than it is to simply roll my eyes and continue dealing with a frustrated generic salesman.

Poor customer service.

This makes me glad that I put my pre-order in with the DVEStore. They actually give a blert about their customers

Seriously though, they do provide good customer service. And they're local if you live in Washington state. I went to their store to pick up my orders when the BMCC and BMPCC arrived, which is impractical with B&H or Adorama, both of whom also care about their customers.

Also if you're in or near Seattle, consider Glazer's Camera. Good customer service there... they're working on expanding to become the B&H of the West Coast.

BM has been releasing camera firmware updates on a more or less three week cycle. They are late. I don't think the 4.6K early pre-order customers are gonna have a merry xmas.

I'm waiting for 4.6K PL so I'm last in line. I figure there's another 20 days of waiting at least for the 4.6K EF version to begin shipping to fulfill preorders. Another month for the PL's to start shipping. Another month or two for the EF to become "in stock" and somewhere before then the PL version will be in stock...I imagine there are less orders for the PL version so it will be in stock slightly faster. I say this because I have seen announcements of PL 4Ks being in stock now while EF 4K's are still backordered. Either way, it'll be February before I have a hope of ordering...but I'm fine with that. There's no other camera for me right now.

BM has been releasing camera firmware updates on a more or less three week cycle. They are late. I don't think the 4.6K early pre-order customers are gonna have a merry xmas.

this makes me sad ...


people crying out for honesty from BMD but if they said that we won't get it till feb or march can you imagine the switch to the Raven or Fs7 from pre orders

BM has been releasing camera firmware updates on a more or less three week cycle. They are late. I don't think the 4.6K early pre-order customers are gonna have a merry xmas.

this makes me sad ...


people crying out for honesty from BMD but if they said that we won't get it till feb or march can you imagine the switch to the Raven or Fs7 from pre orders

I don't get it. The colour science in the ursa right now is far superior to the Sony so that should be a no brainer really. I personally don't enjoy working with red and to me everything I've seen from the 4.6k looks on par with arri - there's no way the wait won't be worth it.


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I think we will have to wait until next NAB.

And blackmagic representative will make a brick face saying "Oh yes, we had small delays with 4,6K but we would like to present our 8.6K 16bit log camera that will be available in July for 3000$"

Unless BM has been hinting that they have a higher resolution sensor in the pipeline I don't think that even BM would be that cheeky and announce an 8.6K product at the next NAB.

Unless BM has been hinting that they have a higher resolution sensor in the pipeline I don't think that even BM would be that cheeky and announce an 8.6K product at the next NAB.

That would be ballsy.

"July... chuckle chuckle..."

I can only imagine what sort of hell the BM engineering and production teams must be going through right now, and with the holidays fast approaching. Being late on one product is bad enough, being soooo late on so many products has got to be hell on earth.

Paul, next you're going to start a rumour about 6K for $6K. Sensor 'full frame' open gate 6144x3457 6 micron photosites 16 stops on URSA, 15 stops on URSA Mini. Designed for DCI 4K deliverables ACES 1.1.


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B&H is now showing the 4K mini with PL mount in stock.

Paul, next you're going to start a rumour about 6K for $6K. Sensor 'full frame' open gate 6144x3457 6 micron photosites 16 stops on URSA, 15 stops on URSA Mini. Designed for DCI 4K deliverables ACES 1.1.

I understood all of that.

B&H is now showing the 4K mini with PL mount in stock.

Yes it is. As are a few others. I imagine there is less demand for the PL versions due to the overall expense inherent to that lens mount. That means I might have mine before some people have their EF 4.6K. Next year, most likely.

Doesn't matter when they announce the 6k for $6k or any new camera. It will always be a year out before anybody sees it. Any camera announced at NAB won't see the light of day till 2017.

it was not rumor it was skepticism

any rumors on when B&H will get more 4k EF's in stock ? I preordered at launch and still haven't gotten any word

any rumors on when B&H will get more 4k EF's in stock ? I preordered at launch and still haven't gotten any word

Tons of rumors. We have heard that B&H is getting shipments every day. We don't know how many units or what units comprise those shipments. I'm sure a very large amount of those preorders they are tasked with fulfilling were submitted this past April, with dozen or hundreds more coming in throughout the year and possibly even as I type this. I imagine the 4K EF is the most ordered of the four Ursa Mini models so I am sure the wait will be realistically very long still.

Ha! Here we go again. Ursa Mini 4K on eBay BIN for $5,500. Lol
http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/272060850369

Some kind of stupid joke. Or someone will buy?

Someone always does.

Someone who didn't read the fine print, "4K." The devil is in the details.


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any rumors on when B&H will get more 4k EF's in stock ? I preordered at launch and still haven't gotten any word

order through Markertek and cancel your order at B&H. I ordered from Markertek last Friday, and my camera is getting delivered tomorrow. before I placed my order, I called them to ask how their backorder list looked, and they said they had just finished getting through all their preorders.


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any rumors on when B&H will get more 4k EF's in stock ? I preordered at launch and still haven't gotten any word

order through Markertek and cancel your order at B&H. I ordered from Markertek last Friday, and my camera is getting delivered tomorrow. before I placed my order, I called them to ask how their backorder list looked, and they said they had just finished getting through all their preorders.


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Really? I called them on Wednesday and they told me that they didn't have any in stock and wouldn't know when they would have the next stock in so I was hesitant to cancel my B&H order. Do you think I should just keep trying with them? I'm hesitant to cancel my B&H order only because I don't want to lose my place in line but I would be much happier if I know that I'd get the camera before Christmas.

Ha! Here we go again. Ursa Mini 4K on eBay BIN for $5,500. Lol
http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/272060850369

Actually, opening bid is $3795. But, for a "used" camera?

any rumors on when B&H will get more 4k EF's in stock ? I preordered at launch and still haven't gotten any word

order through Markertek and cancel your order at B&H. I ordered from Markertek last Friday, and my camera is getting delivered tomorrow. before I placed my order, I called them to ask how their backorder list looked, and they said they had just finished getting through all their preorders.


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Really? I called them on Wednesday and they told me that they didn't have any in stock and wouldn't know when they would have the next stock in so I was hesitant to cancel my B&H order. Do you think I should just keep trying with them? I'm hesitant to cancel my B&H order only because I don't want to lose my place in line but I would be much happier if I know that I'd get the camera before Christmas.

neither place charges you until the camera is shipped, so I'd say place an order with markertek, and just wait to cancel your B&H until the camera ships. that's what I did. if I stayed at B&H I probably wouldn't get my camera for at least a month


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Really? I called them on Wednesday and they told me that they didn't have any in stock and wouldn't know when they would have the next stock in so I was hesitant to cancel my B&H order. Do you think I should just keep trying with them? I'm hesitant to cancel my B&H order only because I don't want to lose my place in line but I would be much happier if I know that I'd get the camera before Christmas.

neither place charges you until the camera is shipped, so I'd say place an order with markertek, and just wait to cancel your B&H until the camera ships. that's what I did. if I stayed at B&H I probably wouldn't get my camera for at least a month


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I'm paying through PayPal credit, which is where my problem lies. Although, I guess that method still works since I have until February to cancel the camera (or until it ships) from B&H until I have to pay for it.

That's a pretty solid plan actually, I may still order from Markertek.

Someone always does.

True of pretty much everything rare and/or early, so it seems...I've seen Star Wars VI tickets early premiere tickets sell for well over $1k, and offered at up to $10k, all for a chance to see the exact same film twelve hours or so hours earlier than they would otherwise. If I sold the four of those my family got free through a lucky connection with some company, I could pretty much buy a Mini 4.6K. I'd do it, except its my father who technically has the tickets and he wasn't exactly fond of the idea.

Its just how supply and demand works, I suppose--low supply, high demand, prices go up. Of course, in our day and age, things get cheaper every year if we wait, which is my plan exactly. In all honestly, I don't have shoots planned that really need what the Mini offers until the summer/fall of next year, so my MLV Raw 7Ds will get my by until then (along with "window shopping" with other folks' great 4.6K footage.)

I love window shopping. I'm such a girl.

And I have zero plans to watch Episode VII until I hear some legit reviews because I stopped liking Star Wars movies in 1999. I think Empire is a great movie regardless of the brand recognition. I dislike anything with JJ Abrams attached, including anything written by anyone who worked on Lost. I hate what they did with the Star Trek movies but not as much as I hate what Rick Berman did to it. I think Ep VII will be exactly like those two Trek movies: fun, diverting, well made, but ultimately shallow fan films that only serve to sell merchandise. Instead of, ya know, a great movie that makes you think and feel. Like Empire. Even Ep IV has that moment when Luke is staring at the twin suns thinking "Ima be here the rest of my life, aren't I?" that makes you, ya know, feeeeeel something. Giggling at action scenes is not feeling anything. That's just a fun movie. I'm ok with fun movies...popcorn movies....guilty pleasure movies....as long as they're entertaining. But I ain't going to spend more than $8 for a ticket and I'm not wasting my time to see it at midnight, nor am i gonna dress up, and I'm not going to be a fan boy and say its the best blahsnlhsartbiknaarv...dont care. So I have hopes Lawrence Kasdan helped and delivered his best script since Empire, but realistically, i think Ep VII will be all looks and no depth. A fun diversion but not a great movie. In the end, however, I am positive it will be a better experience than all three prequel movies combined!!!!! Oh my gawd..... But how do you really feel, Jason? At least we'll get another FANTASTIC score by John Williams. That is just given.

And yeah 7D is pretty alright...

Jason, I'm not as harsh on Abrams as you appear to be, maybe because I liked Lost. Be that as it may I must add that like it or not Abrams is becoming very predictable. I hope he gets the courage to take more chances.