D700 glitches?

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Willem Timmersma

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D700 glitches?

PostWed May 11, 2016 2:08 pm

Hey guys,

Last week I got my late 2013 mac pro, and rendered some clips out of resolve (resolve 12.5 beta 2). And discovered some glitches, horizontal lines in different colors.

Downgraded and tried resolve 12. This time no glitches, and tried the beta 2 version again. Again no glitches till now.

Is this a faulty GPU? That once in a while causes glitches?

Thanks

3,5 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon E5
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James Parker

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 11, 2016 2:14 pm

This happens to most of the d700s at this point. Happens to ours as well. It's when gpus get too hot. There a 15 dollar app that will allow you turn the fans on to high and this helps. Unfortunately I can't remember what the app is right now. I'll update back when I sit down at my station.


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Willem Timmersma

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 11, 2016 2:28 pm

James Parker wrote:This happens to most of the d700s at this point. Happens to ours as well. It's when gpus get too hot. There a 15 dollar app that will allow you turn the fans on to high and this helps. Unfortunately I can't remember what the app is right now. I'll update back when I sit down at my station.


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Thanks James, I just installed TG Pro. I wasn't aware of d700's getting to hot actually. Next time i will boost the fan, and see if that helped.
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Marc Wielage

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 12, 2016 6:29 am

The fan app is called Macs Fan Control:

http://www.crystalidea.com/macs-fan-control

And I am using it on renders just as a precaution, ramping it up to 1800RPM and waiting for the internal temp to get down below 102°F.

On a suggestion from Rohit, I upgraded to OSX 10.11.4, and -- knock on wood -- the glitches appear to have gone away. For now. :?
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostTue May 17, 2016 3:50 am

Marc Wielage wrote:The fan app is called Macs Fan Control:

http://www.crystalidea.com/macs-fan-control

And I am using it on renders just as a precaution, ramping it up to 1800RPM and waiting for the internal temp to get down below 102°F.

On a suggestion from Rohit, I upgraded to OSX 10.11.4, and -- knock on wood -- the glitches appear to have gone away. For now. :?


Could you kill your Fan Control app, and report if you still see the glitches? You should not need that I think.

Thanks,
Rohit
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Willem Timmersma

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostTue May 17, 2016 2:07 pm

Thanks guys! Well I'm on the latest OSX Rohit, I've seen glitches without that app once. After that it's all been good so far and haven't noticed any glitches.
Last edited by Willem Timmersma on Wed May 18, 2016 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Marc Wielage

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 18, 2016 4:44 am

Rohit Gupta wrote:Could you kill your Fan Control app, and report if you still see the glitches? You should not need that I think.

As luck would have it, I had a render needed late this afternoon and had to kick off about 10 minutes in Resolve 12.5. The internal Mac temperature got up to about 145 degrees (very high for this machine), and the fans automatically revved up. No glitches, no problems.

But... this is not a 4K project. The next one starting in a little while will be 4K, so we'll see how that goes.
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 18, 2016 5:18 am

Marc Wielage wrote:
Rohit Gupta wrote:Could you kill your Fan Control app, and report if you still see the glitches? You should not need that I think.

As luck would have it, I had a render needed late this afternoon and had to kick off about 10 minutes in Resolve 12.5. The internal Mac temperature got up to about 145 degrees (very high for this machine), and the fans automatically revved up. No glitches, no problems.

But... this is not a 4K project. The next one starting in a little while will be 4K, so we'll see how that goes.


So just to confirm, you are NOT using your fan control app right?
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Willem Timmersma

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 18, 2016 9:18 am

I was NOT using the app and saw glitches once with a 4k project...
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Marc Wielage

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 19, 2016 1:41 am

Rohit Gupta wrote:So just to confirm, you are NOT using your fan control app right?

I did not use it on the last render I did, no. But the operating system turned up the internal fan by itself, since the temp was hitting 145°. No glitches in a 10-minute render.

I have had cases where I had some mild NR going on just during regular playback and color correction, and I started to get some fairly severe glitches long before I rendered. This has not happened with 12.5, but I also changed to OSX 10.11.4 around the same time.
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 19, 2016 2:28 pm

Marc Wielage wrote:
Rohit Gupta wrote:So just to confirm, you are NOT using your fan control app right?

I did not use it on the last render I did, no. But the operating system turned up the internal fan by itself, since the temp was hitting 145°. No glitches in a 10-minute render.

I have had cases where I had some mild NR going on just during regular playback and color correction, and I started to get some fairly severe glitches long before I rendered. This has not happened with 12.5, but I also changed to OSX 10.11.4 around the same time.


Resolve 12.5 should not make any differences.
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Marc Wielage

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri May 20, 2016 6:32 am

Rohit Gupta wrote:Resolve 12.5 should not make any differences.

Well, as I said, I also switched to OSX 10.11.4 around the same time. I just went with 10.11.5 this week and am supposed to start the 4K project in a few days. We'll see how that goes.
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Willem Timmersma

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 25, 2016 10:30 am

Glitches all over the place using resolve beta 3. Did some testing and made some screenshots of the render. This is a result with a fan ramped up to 1800rpm.

Not 100% sure, but I think I also saw it in the viewer of resolve once.

http://imgur.com/a/iGZel

OSX 10.11.4
Mac Pro 2013
3,5Ghz 6 core
32GB RAM
D700

Resolve 12.5 Beta 3

After a reboot I tried it again, this time the render was clean.
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Mark Sterne

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostWed May 25, 2016 10:44 pm

I am still getting glitches on OSX 10.11.5, sorry to say. So far only when NR is involved.
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 4:52 am

Willem Timmersma wrote:Glitches all over the place using resolve beta 3. Did some testing and made some screenshots of the render. This is a result with a fan ramped up to 1800rpm.

Not 100% sure, but I think I also saw it in the viewer of resolve once.

http://imgur.com/a/iGZel

OSX 10.11.4
Mac Pro 2013
3,5Ghz 6 core
32GB RAM
D700

Resolve 12.5 Beta 3

After a reboot I tried it again, this time the render was clean.


You probably need to get your GPUs swapped by Apple.
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 4:53 am

Mark Sterne wrote:I am still getting glitches on OSX 10.11.5, sorry to say. So far only when NR is involved.


What do the glitches look like? The horizontal lines on the image. If yes, that's probably needs a GPU swap from Apple.
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Mark Sterne

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 5:09 am

Rohit Gupta wrote:
Mark Sterne wrote:I am still getting glitches on OSX 10.11.5, sorry to say. So far only when NR is involved.


What do the glitches look like? The horizontal lines on the image. If yes, that's probably needs a GPU swap from Apple.


Like this:
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 6:23 am

Mark Sterne wrote:
Rohit Gupta wrote:
Mark Sterne wrote:I am still getting glitches on OSX 10.11.5, sorry to say. So far only when NR is involved.


What do the glitches look like? The horizontal lines on the image. If yes, that's probably needs a GPU swap from Apple.


Like this:


Where is the glitch? I presume you are not referring to the black overlay which seems to be part of the picture.
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Adam Simmons

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 6:36 am

I think there's a glitch, top right just above the window, but it's difficult to tell in that picture
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Mark Sterne

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu May 26, 2016 6:34 pm

There is a horizontal line glitch in upper right as Adam says, but the whole black overlay is typical of glitches that I get when the machine is hot and I have NR applied.

The overlay changes in size, shape and location, sometimes conforms to uniform areas of the scene (a face with flat lighting, for example), and appears on one frame and not the next, or is different on the next.

I can post a short clip if you want, I've seen other people post these kinds of glitches so I assumed they were familiar.

Happens with temporal and/or spatial, BMD new or old, and Neat Video too. This one is from the new BMD Spatial "Best" at a fairly high application to deal with noise from a surveillance camera.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri May 27, 2016 2:46 am

Mark Sterne wrote:There is a horizontal line glitch in upper right as Adam says, but the whole black overlay is typical of glitches that I get when the machine is hot and I have NR applied.

The overlay changes in size, shape and location, sometimes conforms to uniform areas of the scene (a face with flat lighting, for example), and appears on one frame and not the next, or is different on the next.

I can post a short clip if you want, I've seen other people post these kinds of glitches so I assumed they were familiar.

Happens with temporal and/or spatial, BMD new or old, and Neat Video too. This one is from the new BMD Spatial "Best" at a fairly high application to deal with noise from a surveillance camera.


It sounds like you are just running out of VRAM more than the D700 glitches (horizontal lines) others have run into. This can happen especially with a 4K timeline and NR.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri May 27, 2016 4:14 am

Definitely could be a VRAM problem, but this is a 1080 timeline... it is at 60fps so that could be a contributing factor.

It has happened in other 1080 timelines at 23.976, though.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri May 27, 2016 5:07 am

I would like to suggest moving this thread out to the 12.5 BETA FEEDBACK forum as these render glitches are not isolated to 12.5.

We have experienced this issue on 3 separate Mac Pro 6,1 systems with D700 GPUs. 2 12-core and 1 8-core system running both Resolve 11 and Resolve 12 on different OS's from 10.9.5 through 10.10.5. The issue definitely appears to be related to noise reduction. All of our timelines are 1080p2398, and (with the exception of my test project) the footage is either Alexa ProRes444 1080p or 10-bit DPX sequences. We normally just see small glitches which consist of horizontal lines, but running a test project I have been able to consistently get full flashing frames, tears, coloured frames, etc.

My test project was simply alternating clips (I used R3D files to stress the system even further) of blur and noise reduction. The blur clips were alternating nodes of full blur, full sharp (about 16 nodes). The NR clips were about 6 nodes of decently strong Spatial and 2 frame temporal NR.

We were able to have Apple swap out the GPUs in one of our 12-core systems twice, then the CPU and the Logic board once, before sending us a brand new system. This completely new system appears to be the most stable of all the systems we have tried. There are no fan control apps running on any of the systems.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu Jul 21, 2016 5:56 pm

After a most unhelpful conversation with BMD tec support about the export glitch with the Mac Pro I am hoping that someone will be able to help me out. Refurbished fully maxed out 8 core trash can, both D700 been changed out, but problem still persists (ocational horizontal lines on exports). Looking for possible solutions and as for now these are the options I have.

- Return the computer and get a brand new 12 core. (but worried that I will still face same issue, just with a more expensive machine).
- keep pushing Apple to change out D700's in the 8 core until they find GPU's that don't have the glitch (seems like a real pain in the ass).
- Go back to editing on my iMac Skylake which has no problems (bud is a bit laggie when playing 4k)

Can anyone that solved the problem chime in. Was exchanging the d700's a permanent solution or only temporary?

Tearing my hair out, thank you for the help.

Sam
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu Jul 21, 2016 8:37 pm

If there's one thing I've learned lurking on this forum the past couple years.......

The "Trashcan" Mac and Resolve is nothing but trouble.

Seems pretty well documented at this point.

If your Trashcan Mac is NOT occasionally rendering bad frames your's the exception and you won the silicon GPU lottery.

Until Apple releases a new workstation design that prioritizes function over form, why even waste your time on them?

You could sell that Trashcan Mac and build a Windows box with a pair of rx 480's that would smoke the performance your current Trashcan. Probably have $ left over too.

If you INSIST on using OS X, downgrade to a Cheesegrater Mac tower or perhaps build a hacintosh.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri Jul 22, 2016 7:50 am

Still getting occasional render glitches, but my third set of D700 GPUs has had fewer glitches than the previous ones.

We could pray for a "Trashcan Mark II" with the equivalent of 3 or 4 Titan X's in it, but until then, we got nothin'. Users of other kinds of software have also reported glitches, like in Premiere and similar programs.

I have had cases where I had severe glitches during color correction, rebooted, and all the glitches went away. So it may be tied to a machine "state" outside of just simply temperature or GPU load.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri Jul 22, 2016 7:12 pm

We have used our beefed up old "cheesegraters" for several months now and – apart from a faulty CPU board that was quickly replaced by the vendor – the two machines for about the price of one nMP have been nothing but stable.

We stayed with Yosemite, though…

If Apple is not getting their act together regarding serious computers, we'll switch to Windows when these machines get too slow for us. I'm afraid I'll hate that.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostFri Jul 22, 2016 11:14 pm

Yeah... Apple the iphone/iwatch company?

I wouldn't count on it.

The windows version of Resolve works well, but the missing ProRes creation feature is a PITA.

At this point maybe Blackmagic should consider opening up the Linux build of Resolve to all Studio dongle holders and not just owners of the Resolve control surface.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSat Jul 23, 2016 8:48 am

If Apple is dropping it's NLE and since there's no further support of QT for Window, the industry will quickly move away from ProRes too. Many of the newer recorders offer DNxHD/HR too.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSun Jul 24, 2016 2:16 am

Uli Plank wrote:If Apple is dropping it's NLE and since there's no further support of QT for Window, the industry will quickly move away from ProRes too. Many of the newer recorders offer DNxHD/HR too.

I haven't heard anything about that. They dropped Aperture and they dropped hardware displays (at the moment), but there's been no sign that they're getting rid of FCPX.

I still wish there was one pref checkbox in FCPX that would say, "show FCP7-style windows, menus, and canvas/view screens," so it was an exact duplicate of FCP7... only 64-bit and capable of resolution-independent editing and raw files. :roll:
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSun Jul 24, 2016 10:15 am

I'm in the same boat, I was so glad to leave Avid behind when FCP came out.

But there is some speculation going on:
http://www.redsharknews.com/post/item/3 ... with-fcp-x
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSun Jul 24, 2016 1:13 pm

I've been experiencing this problem for 2.5 years already. There is a big old thread on Adobe forum about this issue (I'm not allowed to post links, but you can easily google it "RENDER PROBLEM - AME and Premiere Pro CC causing random horizontal lines on H.264 Renders")

Apple did swap my GPU cards, and that eased the problem, but didn't solve it. What I know about it:
1. This is a GPU problem (everybody knows it)
2. This is all about overheating. I get the glitches when the GPUs hit 167℉ (75℃), before the swap, my GPUs used to heat up a lot more easily
3. This is not a Davinci Problem. I get the same horizontal lines in Premiere as well, when I use GPU render or Neat Video noise reduction.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSun Jul 24, 2016 2:42 pm

But that's all it is, speculation. That article doesn't actually say anything
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Marc Wielage

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostSun Jul 24, 2016 11:23 pm

Adam Simmons wrote:But that's all it is, speculation. That article doesn't actually say anything

And I'm not convinced they know anything. They're just filling a column with words.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostMon Jul 25, 2016 6:29 pm

Also wanted to chime in with corroborating evidence about the GPU overheating glitches on nMPs. We have 3 maxed out systems (12c, D700, 1TB SSD, 64GB RAM) in our studio and all have exhibited the same overheating glitches in both Resolve and Adobe apps when pushed beyond a certain threshold (I run a temp monitor and usually see glitches start around 80ºC as measured at the GPU).

We've had Apple replace two of them with completely new machines, but seen no difference in the pattern – it's very, very easy to reproduce (which is the problem!). At this point we're not going to waste more time going back to them to ask for another of the same poorly designed machine on the off chance we get lucky with a pair of higher-binned D700s...

So after a lot of struggling with it I've developed two workflow solutions in Resolve that are not ideal but will at least prevent the glitches:

1.) Turn of idle background caching in General Options. By default it's on and if you're using the Render Cache it will attempt to cache when the machine is idle. It does this at maximum speed, which of course ramps the GPU temp up beyond the safe limits. If you turn this off and cache only during playback I've seen no glitches, even with R3Ds at 4K with TNR, OFX, etc. My guess is that either the natural compute bottleneck per frame is keeping temps low enough to be stable, or by limiting the GPUs to work on only the displayed frame (TNR aside) it's refreshing VRAM regularly enough to alleviate some of the stress on the cards. Of course you lose some of the efficiency of caching by turning this off, but at least you can put a client back in your room without having to apologize for all the funny lines / colors on their film during a session...

2.) Limit Deliver speeds to 10fps. I imagine this works for the same reasons as above, and obviously is a pain if you are trying to deliver something on a deadline, but I used to have to watch renders like a hawk to spot GPU glitches and then render dozens of patches to fix those shots. At least now I can leave them unattended with reasonable confidence that they'll work.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostMon Jul 25, 2016 10:32 pm

I have the same problem on 720 59.94 projects, but only when rendering. Mine look like a color selection flips to negative for 1 frame. I will try the method mentioned to see if it clears up.
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostTue Jul 26, 2016 4:10 am

Jed Mitchell wrote:1.) Turn of idle background caching in General Options. ...2.) Limit Deliver speeds to 10fps.

If I use TNR with HD material, I generally have to slow it down to 5FPS to really be sure. With 4K, it's very dicey, but it can work.

I had the misfortune recently of running 4K R3D's on a D300 machine. Bad idea. It's a little like strapping an outboard motor on the Titanic.
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Chris Coote

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Re: D700 glitches?

PostMon Oct 23, 2017 1:27 pm

We have been getting the same glitches for years. We swapped out our D700's but that didn't solve the problem. I guess the only solution is a new machine?
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Re: D700 glitches?

PostThu Jun 04, 2020 3:03 pm

A very old thread here...
I had to update my OS to 10.14 to finally have such glitches in my Resolve renders, on my 2013 macpro!
I even have some quick lines over the whole UI, from time to time...

Apple of course stopped the D700 exchange pgm, so I'm looking for solution years after everybody.
Can we change those cards ? To the same working ones ? Or different models ?

Thanks for any input,

Best,

Dave

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