Pocket 4K/6K Gimbal Support Coming

Grant said gimbal support is coming in a month or two (same firmware as anamorphic 4:3) for “the popular” gimbals.

Wonder which (I’ve been looking at the Moza Air 2) and exactly how the cameras will interface … and how quickly the gimbal manufacturers will incorporate support.

I know – not much to go on, but I’m starting the thread for those whose speculation is better informed (or just savvier) than mine.

I was also eyeing the moza air 2. Now I guess I'll wait a few more months to see who supports it.


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Grant mentioned Support for the main gimble; I would think maye, Zhiyun,DJI,Moza and tilta.

Richard Marty

really? That would be great.

I've been testing the Crane 3 Lab gimbal for about two months, and I found it quite important to have at least the Crane 3 record button working. Gimbal work often requires several takes to get the movement right, especially if one is not a professional gimbal or steadycam operator. And if the camera does not respond to the Crane 3 record button one has to leave the camera running for all takes. Which does not matter much while shooting, but later at the editing stage you lose a significant amount of time with long clips to find the best take. It's much more comfortable to have each take as separate, incrementally numbered clips. That has become very clear at the beginning of the tests.

So I was thinking about a remote record button device near the Crane 3 grip (if that even exists for the Pocket 4k), or to improvise something with the iPhone app as a workaround, but this would only make the gimbal rig more complicated and less intuitive. Using the record button on the camera is not ideal; you don't want to touch the camera dozens of times when doing gimbal shots, this only adds to the stress that is there anyway.

So, to save time and to make shooting with a gimbal most comfortable, it would be good if there will be some update in camera control for gimbals. That would make the rig I'm building perfect.

I really hope next Pocket 4k/6k firmware update bring autofocus tracking for gimbals or tripod.
These cameras are generally ready for one operator.

Thank you Grant!

I really hope next Pocket 4k/6k firmware update bring autofocus tracking for gimbals or tripod.
These cameras are generally ready for one operator.
Thank you Grant!

The Pocket cameras do not have continuous AF or AF Tracking capability. This appears to be a hardware limitation which is not fIXble with. firmware update.
You would need a camera like the Nikon Z6 to get useable AF tracking to use with a Gimbal.

Indeed how is this connected to the camera, no constant timecode jam if 3.5mm and no usb ssd if usb c. BluetoothLE control is there already. Now if it is with cable then there can be grips that control with cable instead of BluetoothLE.

I really hope next Pocket 4k/6k firmware update bring autofocus tracking for gimbals or tripod.
These cameras are generally ready for one operator.
Thank you Grant!

The Pocket cameras do not have continuous AF or AF Tracking capability. This appears to be a hardware limitation which is not fIXble with. firmware update.
You would need a camera like the Nikon Z6 to get useable AF tracking to use with a Gimbal.

Help me to think: I don't have skills to determine if the camera can track an object or not. But I believe in the actual capability and is a touch in the screen on an object/face and the camera make focus on it. After that, the camera can determine what is in focus or not, by the the peaking/lines on screen. The next upgrade Grant talk about a new function to determine the horizontal and inclination level. Considering these factors, it's not impossible a function where we touch/mark an object and when the peaking perceive more contrast or definition, continue follow the best contrast/focuss. Other method could be to map differents pixels focus like other brands have implemented. I know this basic method could not be competent like Sony sensors, or in scene with too much movements. But for an interview, and actor making two steps, a singer... will be enormous...

Does anyone know more specific about what this update will add?

I forgot about this announcement so thanks for the reminder.

I'd just be happy to have start/stop recording control from my Moza Air 2. But, if you have a Lumix lens, I can totally see how you can also use the gimbal wheel to control focus without having to mount an iFocus attachment.

The Moza AirCross 2 features the BMPCC4K in its advertising. How that translates to reality is yet to be seen.

That is good news. BMD said something they would support the major gimbal vendors without being specific about the extent of course at that time.


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You have to wonder. Is this enthusiasm coming from hope or experience?

Operating a gimbal is hard enough without pulling focus or performing zooms..... And look at the typical big budget steadicam shot. Wide angles and constant distance from the subject. I wonder why?

[Kristian Lam]

Quick answer is that we are adding support for USB PTP communication which these gimbals use.

They will be able to control the camera via USB which they currently already supported by other cameras.

Rec start stop, focus, Iris and other common settings should be accessible.

That will be very good, cool...
Cheers

Thanks, Kristian.


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Quick answer is that we are adding support for USB PTP communication which these gimbals use.

They will be able to control the camera via USB which they currently already supported by other cameras.

Rec start stop, focus, Iris and other common settings should be accessible.

Very cool, but how will tat affect shooters using SSDs ? Will a splitter be possible?

Yes. I was thinking the same with the SSD. How could both be used at the same time.

The moza air cross sounds promising


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Kim, I think the target for gimbal support is the same firmware 6.6 due in a month or so that brings so many other eagerly anticipated improvements to the BMPCC4K. No idea whatever else may be available in the future for that Pocket4K, but so grateful when 6. 6 is done.


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The Moza Air 2 gimbal comes with several cables to control other cameras so it will be a welcome update once the Pocket 4K brings the same functionality.

The Moza Air 2 gimbal comes with several cables to control other cameras so it will be a welcome update once the Pocket 4K brings the same functionality.

According to the Moza webpage (https://www.gudsen.com/moza-aircross-2) the AirCross 2 has "3 outputs with a 7.8V power supply"; P4K needs 12V. But the rest seems good: the gimbal weight is 1Kg, itd payload 3.2Kg, has follow focus etc. etc.

I'm not sure if it's posible use the audio mini plug - like timecode external accessories offered by Grant - or maybe bluetooth - like mobile app - and not only the USB C that could be used for the SSD.

Looks good except for the powering. I wonder if it could hold the pf4k with the new battery grip?

Ricardo Marty

Power source seems the main problem to solve IMHO.

Powering the BMPCC 4K or 6K on a gimbal is an annoying problem, especially with short lasting batteries and the need to remove the cam from the gimbal and rebalance after every battery swap.

I was powering the 4K wit the Moza Air 2 through Alvin's cable but the 6K seems to draw too much so that the gimbal shuts down...

Relying on LPE6 batteries is a pain when operating a gimbal.

Power source seems the main problem to solve IMHO.

Powering the BMPCC 4K or 6K on a gimbal is an annoying problem, especially with short lasting batteries and the need to remove the cam from the gimbal and rebalance after every battery swap.

I was powering the 4K wit the Moza Air 2 through Alvin's cable but the 6K seems to draw too much so that the gimbal shuts down...

Relying on LPE6 batteries is a pain when operating a gimbal.

Agreed, I was thinking of using this battery plate

It seems the only way at this time.

But where are U gonna attach it coz it's pretty heavy even with a slim batt?

It seems the only way at this time.

But where are U gonna attach it coz it's pretty heavy even with a slim batt?

Underneath the camera, the Pocket 4K is not very tall so I think it will work, although Tilta has suggested attaching it to the bottom of the Ronin where the tripod attachment goes.

@ BM: Please add Pilotfly Maverick to your list of popular gimbals. Its just perfect with the tilt-arm on the left and the shorter roll arm.

Power source seems the main problem to solve IMHO.

Powering the BMPCC 4K or 6K on a gimbal is an annoying problem, especially with short lasting batteries and the need to remove the cam from the gimbal and rebalance after every battery swap.

I was powering the 4K wit the Moza Air 2 through Alvin's cable but the 6K seems to draw too much so that the gimbal shuts down...

Relying on LPE6 batteries is a pain when operating a gimbal.

Do you have the 16.8V version of the Moza Air 2? If you have the 12V, it'll burn it out.

To pnguyen720

I took great care to get the 16v version directly from Gudsen, as I have previously read about the different flavours on the blogs.

It works well with the Pocket 4K but with the 6K, gimbal turns off after 30 seconds. If I don't turn on the cam, then the gimbal works flawlessly.

Seems to point to a power draw problem...

To pnguyen720

I took great care to get the 16v version directly from Gudsen, as I have previously read about the different flavours on the blogs.

It works well with the Pocket 4K but with the 6K, gimbal turns off after 30 seconds. If I don't turn on the cam, then the gimbal works flawlessly.

Seems to point to a power draw problem...

Hmm.. that is definitely good to know.

Any news on the viability a USB C splitter so that USB remote and SSD can be used at the same time?

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Any news on the viability a USB C splitter so that USB remote and SSD can be used at the same time?

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is that a thing? can you even do that with a type c?

so now with 6.6 firmware, we have usb PTP support...
has anyone tested it with any gimbal? preferrably with the moza air2 ?
further, if it really works, are there ways now to split USB into dual port for SSD and PTP?
thx
Mike

so now with 6.6 firmware, we have usb PTP support...
has anyone tested it with any gimbal? preferrably with the moza air2 ?
further, if it really works, are there ways now to split USB into dual port for SSD and PTP?
thx
Mike

Nobody can until some gimble supports it.


Ricardo Marty

well, imho USB PTP is a well-defined standard, so probably it works out of the box...

well, imho USB PTP is a well-defined standard, so probably it works out of the box...

Nope, not with the Ronin S anyway.

Anyone know if the usb ptp support work with Ronin S now with their new firmware update?

[Kristian Lam]

Anyone know if the usb ptp support work with Ronin S now with their new firmware update?

Some discussion about it here:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=103217

Hi, any news on supporting camera controls Crane 3 gimbal?

[Kristian Lam]

Hi, any news on supporting camera controls Crane 3 gimbal?

Please check with the respective gimbal manufacturers.

Hi, any news on supporting camera controls Crane 3 gimbal?

write them. I did, but the reply was not very encouraging. There also appears to be a language barrier, which is a bit problematic for a company that ships and advertises internationally. As far as I can see, it's just about software and protocols. The hardware is here, as well as the P4k protocol.

In those feature request mails, it is important to point out that all supported cameras are stills photography cameras. While the real advantage of gimbals are actually dedicated cinema cameras.

Personally I don't quite get it why Zhiyun haven't updated the Crane 3 yet for the P4k. It is high time. Maybe next year?

Patience. They will deliver. And if not, their gimbals are still great right now. It's just odd to have more work at the editing stage as necessary. It could be so much easier if they just provided start/stop.

Hi, any news on supporting camera controls Crane 3 gimbal?

write them. I did, but the reply was not very encouraging. There also appears to be a language barrier, which is a bit problematic for a company that ships and advertises internationally. As far as I can see, it's just about software and protocols. The hardware is here, as well as the P4k protocol.

In those feature request mails, it is important to point out that all supported cameras are stills photography cameras. While the real advantage of gimbals are actually dedicated cinema cameras.

Personally I don't quite get it why Zhiyun haven't updated the Crane 3 yet for the P4k. It is high time. Maybe next year?

Patience. They will deliver. And if not, their gimbals are still great right now. It's just odd to have more work at the editing stage as necessary. It could be so much easier if they just provided start/stop.

The new zhiyun webill s supports the p4k, It's on there compatibility list you just need a small counterweight its even on their webill s release video. I just purchased one but haven't had time to try it with the p4k.

Ricardo Marty

Not having auto tracking focus is ok for me, I do not use it but start/stop recording would be great.
Portkeys now have full BT control for Pocket so it should be possible, hopefully Gimbal developers will think of this possibility in the future.

@ricardo: Have you tested the Weebill-S with the BMPCC4K yet?

Does it need a counterweight, if you only use a Lumix 12-35 lens?

Can you control the electronic focus of the camera with the latest gimbal software?

@ricardo: Have you tested the Weebill-S with the BMPCC4K yet?

Does it need a counterweight, if you only use a Lumix 12-35 lens?

Can you control the electronic focus of the camera with the latest gimbal software?

No I haven't yet. Been to busy. I expect to try it out during Christmas. Ill post. However Zhiyun says that a counterweight is necessary with the p4k but i don't know if it has m
has to do with the lens. I don't think the 12-40 would be much of a problem. The weight is small you can check it out in amazon.

Ricardo Marty

Hi, any news on supporting camera controls Crane 3 gimbal?

Please check with the respective gimbal manufacturers.

That is exactly what gimbal manufacturer is saying - check with camera manufacturer.
Ping-pong... and nobody is looking for solution

I have the weebill-s and the image transmission module. Once everything rigged up you will have record, aperture, shutter, iso and exposure comp accessible via the gimbal. You will need a counter weight for any lenses bigger than the 17 1.8, 25 1.8 and 45 1.8 from olympus.

I forgot about this announcement so thanks for the reminder.

I'd just be happy to have start/stop recording control from my Moza Air 2. But, if you have a Lumix lens, I can totally see how you can also use the gimbal wheel to control focus without having to mount an iFocus attachment.

It's been a while but rec start/stop is working now with the BMPCC and Air2 with the latest firmware. Also tracking and mime are new and nice options of the new Moza app!

I forgot about this announcement so thanks for the reminder.

I'd just be happy to have start/stop recording control from my Moza Air 2. But, if you have a Lumix lens, I can totally see how you can also use the gimbal wheel to control focus without having to mount an iFocus attachment.

It's been a while but rec start/stop is working now with the BMPCC and Air2 with the latest firmware. Also tracking and mime are new and nice options of the new Moza app!

Nice! Which cable are you using for stop/start?