- Posts: 1144
- Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 7:12 pm
- Real Name: Peter Jackson
The intention of this post is to serve as a container for issues others and I reported over the last months that are in my humble opinion all caused by Resolve also dispatching work to integrated Intel GPUs on laptops with an additional Nvidia GPU.
What is the point? I spend some time trying to debug the issues I have with Resolve on my XPS 9750 (specs below) and figured they all completely disappear for good once I prevent Resolve from recognizing / using the integrated Intel GPU. This however has unacceptable side effects, hence this post begging for a fix on the Resolve side to ignore the integrated GPU for good.
The trouble with virtually all modern dual GPU laptops is that it is not possible to disable the integrated GPU via BIOS or other means as the integrated GPU is what drives the screen of the laptop and whatever the Nvidia card possibly renders needs to be relayed back to the Intel GPU to actually display it on screen.
However, it’s possible to disable the Intel GPU from the Device Manager on Win 10. That way it stays physically active and still does the relaying, but is no longer visible to the OS and applications using its APIs to query for the list of GPUs in the system. This has various side effects. At least it breaks: Ability to use multiple displays, switching of the active display, both the Nvidia and Intel control panel apps, selection of refresh rates, power management and display settings. So, this is just a hack to force Resolve to ignore the integrated GPU for testing, not a usable workaround.
Sometimes external display port or HDMI connectors are wired directly to the Nvidia card on such laptops, sometimes they are also relayed through the Intel GPU. As for the XPS 9750 online sources seem to indicated that the display port connector is wired directly to the Nvidia card, while the Nvidia control panel software seems to suggests otherwise. So, I’m not 100% sure about it. I’m just mentioning this as my testing indicates that at least one crash issue disappears if only an external display is connected (I guess wired to the Nvidia card) and the internal laptop display is disabled. When trying to reproduce the issues this post is about, please be sure to use only the internal laptop screen with no screens attached to external connectors, so the relaying is actually happening for sure.
Now before people start to complain that the GTX 1050 Ti of the XPS 9750 is underpowered and it’s not a valid platform to work on anyways: Yes, Razor Core X and GTX 1080 Ti should arrive early next week. I’m however pretty sure, I’ll still see Resolve dispatching work to the integrated GPU and crash out as well with the Razor Core connected. Plus, looking around these forums, lots of people seems to be looking for a laptop platform to at least get some basic editing done on the road that does not involve color sensitive work and virtually all laptops these days do relay through an integrated Intel GPU.
Below is a list of issues with their matching logs, threads and what I learned about them during testing:
1.) Resolve crashes hard when attempting to browse a media folder in thumbnail view on the media page.This has been reported by others and me. For me this started to happen with 15.2.x, and never happened with 15.1.x or any earlier versions of Resolve. This issue is completely gone both with disabled Intel GPU or when only an external display is active via display port. Changelogs of 15.2.x mention performance improvement for the viewer on laptops with Intel GPU. As far as I understand it attempts to do more work on the Intel GPU for better display performance. Maybe this change has something to do with it. It makes NO difference whether H264/H265 hardware decoding is on or off in settings.
Logs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/257uxr2ugrhps ... 0.zip?dl=0
Threads: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=83963 and viewtopic.php?f=21&t=83965
2.) Resolve allocates all 32GB main memory within seconds, 100 GB of swap, becomes unresponsive and finally dies when quickly previewing multiple H265 (8 bit, 200Mbit, 60fps, 4k) clips on the media page or elsewhere. I’m 100% positive from monitoring tools that Resolve is dispatching hardware video decode for H264/H265 to the Intel GPU once the Nvidia GPU is too busy from being asked to decode many different clips in a short time. It never recovers from this. The Nvidia GPU becomes idle, the Intel GPU is busy in hardware video decode until Resolves dies with out of memory. This issue is complete gone for good with the Intel GPU disabled. Haven’t tested the other case with an external display only for this issue yet. I can supply the H265 files if necessary for repo.
Logs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3so2fnz9fduzg ... 7.zip?dl=0
Thread: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=82333
3.) Generation of optimized media with hardware decoded H264/H265 no longer possible with 15.2.x, works with 15.1.x and earlier versions. Since 15.2.x any attempt to generate optimized media with hardware H264/H265 triggers issue 2.) and runs out of memory. I’m 100% positive from monitoring tools that Resolve is dispatching hardware video decode for H264/H265 to the Intel GPU in addition to the Nvidia card. This issue is also complete gone for good with the Intel GPU disabled. Haven’t tested the other case with an external display only for this issue yet.
Logs and thread see 2.)
4.) Smooth timeline playback no longer possible with 15.2.2 as Resolve also starts to dispatch video decode and as it seems also compute to the Intel GPU at least once the Nvidia GPU can't keep up. However it seems once it decided to schedule work to the Intel GPU it never comes back to the Nvidia GPU at all. Only a restart of Resolve helps. No thread it logs yet.
For none of these issues it made any difference if GPU selection mode in settings was set to auto or manual with only Nvidia GPU selected. Also toggling use display GPU for compute didn’t change anything.
Now as far as I know Resolve already has lots of special handling for Intel GPUs. They don't appear in the list of selectable GPUs in settings and should be mostly ignored by Resolve as they are too slow. However recently it seems some adjustments have been made to silently dispatch some work to Intel GPUs for smoother playback on laptops. My ask about is simple: Make it transparent. Reintroduce the Intel GPUs in the list of selectable GPUs in settings and allow users to opt out or in for these optimization. For now it breaks everything and makes Resolve unusable. No possibly better playback performance could be worth it. That way users can try these optimizations from time to time as you may improve them but have a stable system otherwise.
Platform info: @Dwaine Maggart I sent you the system info NFO.
XPS 9750, 32GB RAM, GTX 1050 Ti, 2TB NVM, BIOS 1.6, Win 10 latest patches, latest Nvidia driver from GeForce Experience.
I don’t want to end with too much crying, but with Laptop, eGPU, Resolve Studio, Resolve Training, BM IO hardware and screens it is a fair bit of money spend and I still can’t use Resolve for anything.
As this system is only used for Resolve I can offer unlimited access to it over team viewer, the ability to install any debuggers or dev tools, me capturing additional dumps via procdump or similar if the mini dumps Resolve creates seem not sufficient or provide source media. I’m also willing to ship this Laptop over to wherever Resolve devs can take as look at it. I really want to be able to finally use Resolve.
Thanks for looking into it.
What is the point? I spend some time trying to debug the issues I have with Resolve on my XPS 9750 (specs below) and figured they all completely disappear for good once I prevent Resolve from recognizing / using the integrated Intel GPU. This however has unacceptable side effects, hence this post begging for a fix on the Resolve side to ignore the integrated GPU for good.
The trouble with virtually all modern dual GPU laptops is that it is not possible to disable the integrated GPU via BIOS or other means as the integrated GPU is what drives the screen of the laptop and whatever the Nvidia card possibly renders needs to be relayed back to the Intel GPU to actually display it on screen.
However, it’s possible to disable the Intel GPU from the Device Manager on Win 10. That way it stays physically active and still does the relaying, but is no longer visible to the OS and applications using its APIs to query for the list of GPUs in the system. This has various side effects. At least it breaks: Ability to use multiple displays, switching of the active display, both the Nvidia and Intel control panel apps, selection of refresh rates, power management and display settings. So, this is just a hack to force Resolve to ignore the integrated GPU for testing, not a usable workaround.
Sometimes external display port or HDMI connectors are wired directly to the Nvidia card on such laptops, sometimes they are also relayed through the Intel GPU. As for the XPS 9750 online sources seem to indicated that the display port connector is wired directly to the Nvidia card, while the Nvidia control panel software seems to suggests otherwise. So, I’m not 100% sure about it. I’m just mentioning this as my testing indicates that at least one crash issue disappears if only an external display is connected (I guess wired to the Nvidia card) and the internal laptop display is disabled. When trying to reproduce the issues this post is about, please be sure to use only the internal laptop screen with no screens attached to external connectors, so the relaying is actually happening for sure.
Now before people start to complain that the GTX 1050 Ti of the XPS 9750 is underpowered and it’s not a valid platform to work on anyways: Yes, Razor Core X and GTX 1080 Ti should arrive early next week. I’m however pretty sure, I’ll still see Resolve dispatching work to the integrated GPU and crash out as well with the Razor Core connected. Plus, looking around these forums, lots of people seems to be looking for a laptop platform to at least get some basic editing done on the road that does not involve color sensitive work and virtually all laptops these days do relay through an integrated Intel GPU.
Below is a list of issues with their matching logs, threads and what I learned about them during testing:
1.) Resolve crashes hard when attempting to browse a media folder in thumbnail view on the media page.This has been reported by others and me. For me this started to happen with 15.2.x, and never happened with 15.1.x or any earlier versions of Resolve. This issue is completely gone both with disabled Intel GPU or when only an external display is active via display port. Changelogs of 15.2.x mention performance improvement for the viewer on laptops with Intel GPU. As far as I understand it attempts to do more work on the Intel GPU for better display performance. Maybe this change has something to do with it. It makes NO difference whether H264/H265 hardware decoding is on or off in settings.
Logs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/257uxr2ugrhps ... 0.zip?dl=0
Threads: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=83963 and viewtopic.php?f=21&t=83965
2.) Resolve allocates all 32GB main memory within seconds, 100 GB of swap, becomes unresponsive and finally dies when quickly previewing multiple H265 (8 bit, 200Mbit, 60fps, 4k) clips on the media page or elsewhere. I’m 100% positive from monitoring tools that Resolve is dispatching hardware video decode for H264/H265 to the Intel GPU once the Nvidia GPU is too busy from being asked to decode many different clips in a short time. It never recovers from this. The Nvidia GPU becomes idle, the Intel GPU is busy in hardware video decode until Resolves dies with out of memory. This issue is complete gone for good with the Intel GPU disabled. Haven’t tested the other case with an external display only for this issue yet. I can supply the H265 files if necessary for repo.
Logs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/3so2fnz9fduzg ... 7.zip?dl=0
Thread: viewtopic.php?f=21&t=82333
3.) Generation of optimized media with hardware decoded H264/H265 no longer possible with 15.2.x, works with 15.1.x and earlier versions. Since 15.2.x any attempt to generate optimized media with hardware H264/H265 triggers issue 2.) and runs out of memory. I’m 100% positive from monitoring tools that Resolve is dispatching hardware video decode for H264/H265 to the Intel GPU in addition to the Nvidia card. This issue is also complete gone for good with the Intel GPU disabled. Haven’t tested the other case with an external display only for this issue yet.
Logs and thread see 2.)
4.) Smooth timeline playback no longer possible with 15.2.2 as Resolve also starts to dispatch video decode and as it seems also compute to the Intel GPU at least once the Nvidia GPU can't keep up. However it seems once it decided to schedule work to the Intel GPU it never comes back to the Nvidia GPU at all. Only a restart of Resolve helps. No thread it logs yet.
For none of these issues it made any difference if GPU selection mode in settings was set to auto or manual with only Nvidia GPU selected. Also toggling use display GPU for compute didn’t change anything.
Now as far as I know Resolve already has lots of special handling for Intel GPUs. They don't appear in the list of selectable GPUs in settings and should be mostly ignored by Resolve as they are too slow. However recently it seems some adjustments have been made to silently dispatch some work to Intel GPUs for smoother playback on laptops. My ask about is simple: Make it transparent. Reintroduce the Intel GPUs in the list of selectable GPUs in settings and allow users to opt out or in for these optimization. For now it breaks everything and makes Resolve unusable. No possibly better playback performance could be worth it. That way users can try these optimizations from time to time as you may improve them but have a stable system otherwise.
Platform info: @Dwaine Maggart I sent you the system info NFO.
XPS 9750, 32GB RAM, GTX 1050 Ti, 2TB NVM, BIOS 1.6, Win 10 latest patches, latest Nvidia driver from GeForce Experience.
I don’t want to end with too much crying, but with Laptop, eGPU, Resolve Studio, Resolve Training, BM IO hardware and screens it is a fair bit of money spend and I still can’t use Resolve for anything.
As this system is only used for Resolve I can offer unlimited access to it over team viewer, the ability to install any debuggers or dev tools, me capturing additional dumps via procdump or similar if the mini dumps Resolve creates seem not sufficient or provide source media. I’m also willing to ship this Laptop over to wherever Resolve devs can take as look at it. I really want to be able to finally use Resolve.
Thanks for looking into it.
Last edited by peterjackson on Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:57 am, edited 4 times in total.
5950x, 3090, 128GB.