Introducing Blackmagic Production Camera 4K

For all the doomsdayers, check out this video with the president Dan May. The BMPC is an awesome cam but only shoots prores right now, 12 stops and is not as sharp as the BMCC.

I don't understand how a 4K camera could be less sharper than a 2,5K camera?

obviously different sensor issue

Curious on the name. Why "Production" Camera" and not consistent with the "Cinema" Camera?

Honestly I think has to do with what they see it being used for. The CC has a bigger DR, which is what indie film makers love. The PC is jacked and ready for the coming changes in TV. 4k is gonna be the selling points on all TVs in a few years just like 1080p was. Also the new sdi output is all ready to go for live production. The cinema camera Algorithum was written with film in mind, they even created a BMD film codec for davinci. With the PC they went to a new family of sensors which alsoeans they lost the "look" of the original which is something film geeks (like myself) love about it, not to say they won't get it, but from what I've read it's not the same but damn close.

As long as they can match the current colour science of the BMCC I am happy. If its a tad less sharp, I am fine with as well. The Ikonoskop is less sharp but looks more organic. Heck, I am nitpicking...let the BMPC come out!

For all the doomsdayers, check out this video with the president Dan May. The BMPC is an awesome cam but only shoots prores right now, 12 stops and is not as sharp as the BMCC.

I don't understand how a 4K camera could be less sharper than a 2,5K camera?

The pixels are closer together.

For all the doomsdayers, check out this video with the president Dan May. The BMPC is an awesome cam but only shoots prores right now, 12 stops and is not as sharp as the BMCC.

I don't understand how a 4K camera could be less sharper than a 2,5K camera?

The pixels are closer together.

The BMPC being 4k will have more details than the BMCC 2.5k but per pixel the BMCC is sharper. The same science as the D800 has higher MP and more details than the 5DMkIII but per pixel not as sharp as the Canon. Never confuse sharpness with details.

Thank you I understand better. So if we compare the picture of both camera (BMCC & BMPC) at 100% the BMCC will look sharper.
But if we downgrade shots from both cameras at 1080p in postproduction, the pictures issued of the 4K camera should look sharper than the picture issued of the BMCC, right?

Thank you I understand better. So if we compare the picture of both camera (BMCC & BMPC) at 100% the BMCC will look sharper.
But if we downgrade shots from both cameras at 1080p in postproduction, the pictures issued of the 4K camera should look sharper than the picture issued of the BMCC, right?

Perceived sharper in terms of more details. Yes.

On this page

http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/product ... /techspecs

it says:

Full version of DaVinci Resolve in the top paragraph but at the bottom under software it says:

DaVinci Resolve Lite grading software

Which is it?

On this page

http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/product ... /techspecs

it says:

Full version of DaVinci Resolve in the top paragraph but at the bottom under software it says:

DaVinci Resolve Lite grading software

Which is it?

Full version for BMC4K and Lite for BMPC

Is posible raw uncompresed 1080p?

For all the doomsdayers, check out this video with the president Dan May. The BMPC is an awesome cam but only shoots prores right now, 12 stops and is not as sharp as the BMCC.

I don't understand how a 4K camera could be less sharper than a 2,5K camera?

The BMPC being 4k will have more details than the BMCC 2.5k but per pixel the BMCC is sharper. The same science as the D800 has higher MP and more details than the 5DMkIII but per pixel not as sharp as the Canon. Never confuse sharpness with details.

I believe most of those explanations are true; however, we are overlooking one very important element... bit rate.

The BMCC is raw @ 12-bit vs compressed @ 10-bit, so NOT lossy or visually lossless but RAW which is why the file sizes are so much larger on the BMCC, which ultimately helps with the sharpness.

I just got my BMCC less than 2 months ago...
I feel a bit taken advantage off.

It's the first time I don't have good feelings about your product.
I used the camera once, I enjoyed it despite no changeable battery and a huge crop factor...
Now, 2 months after, it's obsolete.
I got the camera mostly because of the strereoscopic capabilities of Resolve (and they don't work).
I should have just waited...

Is there any upgrade policy like RED has?

Thanks,

Emmanuel Albano
http://www.3motion.ca

I just got my BMCC less than 2 months ago...
I feel a bit taken advantage off.

It's the first time I don't have good feelings about your product.
I used the camera once, I enjoyed it despite no changeable battery and a huge crop factor...
Now, 2 months after, it's obsolete.
I got the camera mostly because of the strereoscopic capabilities of Resolve (and they don't work).
I should have just waited...

Is there any upgrade policy like RED has?

Thanks,

Emmanuel Albano
http://www.3motion.ca

How is it obsolete? The camera stopped working all of a sudden?

Perhaps return it.

Hey

I was always told there is no such thing as a dumb question...I have a 50mm f2 Helios 44-2 and a Nikon Nikkor 80-200mm f/4.5 non ai. Someone gifted these lenses to me when I told them I was planning on buying a camera Will these work on the Production Camera...How will they fare? I plan to buy some new glass but not until I have camera in hand, if these two will be compatible then its less I'll need to purchase right away.

thanks

I just got my BMCC less than 2 months ago...
I feel a bit taken advantage off.

It's the first time I don't have good feelings about your product.
I used the camera once, I enjoyed it despite no changeable battery and a huge crop factor...
Now, 2 months after, it's obsolete.
I got the camera mostly because of the strereoscopic capabilities of Resolve (and they don't work).
I should have just waited...

Is there any upgrade policy like RED has?

Thanks,

Emmanuel Albano
http://www.3motion.ca

It's not obsolete! They just expanded the types of cameras they offer... You still have uncompressed RAW, sharper image quality and more dynamic range. The 4K is a different type of camera. You just feel ripped off because you had less of a choice.

I just got my BMCC less than 2 months ago...
I feel a bit taken advantage off.

It's the first time I don't have good feelings about your product.
I used the camera once, I enjoyed it despite no changeable battery and a huge crop factor...
Now, 2 months after, it's obsolete.
I got the camera mostly because of the strereoscopic capabilities of Resolve (and they don't work).
I should have just waited...

Is there any upgrade policy like RED has?

Thanks,

Emmanuel Albano
http://www.3motion.ca

It's not obsolete! They just expanded the types of cameras they offer... You still have uncompressed RAW, sharper image quality and more dynamic range. The 4K is a different type of camera. You just feel ripped off because you had less of a choice.

There's no way 2.5K 13 stops of dynamic range is obsolete. You get more DR on the BMCC but more resolution on the 4K cam. Would you call the Alexa obsolete in terms of resolution? No. Def not. They are different cams with different features for different people. The beauty is that now we can pick what we want.

Is BMD adding uncompress RAW on the BMPC 4K in future firmware update?

If the sensor is really the http://www.cmosis.com/products/standard_products/cmv12000 it should be possible to output 90-150fps at 1080p and 60fps at 2.5K.

For all the doomsdayers, check out this video with the president Dan May. The BMPC is an awesome cam but only shoots prores right now, 12 stops and is not as sharp as the BMCC.

I don't understand how a 4K camera could be less sharper than a 2,5K camera?

I am also trying to get it. But I think what the more knowledgable users than us are saying is sharpness is not equal to detail. 4K has more detail, 2.5K is sharper. Has nothing to do with the size of the image...but more to do with the quality of the individual pixels in that image. So..at 2.5K 12 bit, the pixels have more data (higher contrast and chroma information) than many pixels at 4K with less info (lower contrast and chroma info).
I think am almost there
Kinda like a 1D series with lower resolution 16-18MP but sharper than a 5D3 with 22MP. Its in the quality of the pixels - making them sharper in comparison to having more detail

If the sensor is really the http://www.cmosis.com/products/standard_products/cmv12000 it should be possible to output 90-150fps at 1080p and 60fps at 2.5K.

Then its probably a sustainability move. Early adopters get it for quality and its potential
...then in a year or two...they unlock those features to get more sales on older tech. Oldest trick in the book

I have a 50mm f2 Helios 44-2 and a Nikon Nikkor 80-200mm f/4.5 non ai. Someone gifted these lenses to me when I told them I was planning on buying a camera Will these work on the Production Camera...How will they fare?

Both lenses will work on the Production Camera with the correct adapter. M42 to EF (I'm assuming the Helio is M42) and Nikon to EF.

They are both old lenses. They will work but will not be as sharp as a modern Zeiss or Angenieux cine lens. Over sharp can sometimes look harsh so this could be a good thing.

I personally love the look of the old Russian lenses like the Helio. I have a set (37mm MIR-1, 58mm Helios, 85mm Jupiter) that I use on some jobs.

If the sensor is really the http://www.cmosis.com/products/standard_products/cmv12000 it should be possible to output 90-150fps at 1080p and 60fps at 2.5K.

Then its probably a sustainability move. Early adopters get it for quality and its potential
...then in a year or two...they unlock those features to get more sales on older tech. Oldest trick in the book

Right. Same thing happened to Alexa when Arri added the 120fps via a firmware update.
I really hope BM will do the same. Higher fps is the only thing missing in my opinion.

They did say in one of the interviews I saw online that they will look at adding higher frame rates via firmware in the future. But he stressed two things, that that they won't be looking at that now, they're just focused on a max of 30fps before it ships, and that they aren't sure if higher frame rates are even possible.

To me that sounds like the sensor is indeed rated to a higher frame rate (else it's just a flat out not possible from the start?) but that they aren't sure about other things, perhaps the throughput, storage, heatsink, I dunno what.

So there's hope, but obviously I wouldn't hold my breath.

Maybe I've missed this specs somewhere...
Does anybody know what are the shutter angle values for the new BMCC4k?
Can we shoot with a fast shutter angle of like 22.5º?

Is BMD adding uncompress RAW on the BMPC 4K in future firmware update?

Probably not. The required data rates are likely too high for the recording system.

John Brawley says:
"... Recording to the same media in RAW would be impossible at 4K data rates uncompressed in RAW so they’ve had to stick with ProRes for the moment. It’s still visually lossless at 2.5:1 though. They are planning to introduce compressed RAW DNG’s later on down the track. This is probably one of the first cameras to use the new 6GB/s HD-SDI standard too, which allows for lots of interesting possibilities down the track. I think there’s plans for the better 12 bit flavours of ProRes but for now it’s 10bit 422. ..."

Excerpted from:
http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... e-orginal/

Maybe I've missed this specs somewhere...
Does anybody know what are the shutter angle values for the new BMCC4k?
Can we shoot with a fast shutter angle of like 22.5º?

I don't believe it's been published yet. The BMPC-4K is in early beta, not complete yet, so it may be premature to announce that level of detail.

It's possible the camera may offer different shutter angles than the current BMCC, but note that it could be the same, or more, or less. Also, BMD added additional shutter angles to the BMCC after its initial release, so it might be possible for that to happen with the BMPC-4K after its release, too. We'll have to wait & see.

Very important...why no dnxhd???? Its better and more versatile then prores and no pc users will by this if you exclude people who actually have decent computers instead of hipster notebooks.

There is no such thing as a bigger then 1080p Dnxhd.

I’m looking forward to next year, (perhaps during NAB 2014?), when BlackMagic introduces their 4th entry, the TMBMCC, or “Truly Magical BlackMagic Cinema Camera.” Complete with an operational (beta) magic wand for all the geniuses and smart mouths that don’t want further technological development beyond the date they have taken delivery of their camera yet permits them to make unlimited improvements to their own camera at will (without respect to engineering). Planned future additions, through firmware updates, include the ability for levitation, time travel, and an automatic Oscar nomination. Also included, at no additional cost, is a pacifier for those who are never satisfied (or just plain crabby).

I'm sure the 4K is a dream.

But so far with the way BMD has handled the release of the BMC 2.5 it will remain in most people's dreams.

They say this camera will ship in July.

Truth is, with all the other demands on BMD's previous design, that dawg don't hunt.

BMD has failed to meet delivery targets from the get go....

So when Christmas 2013 arrives and filmmakers are still waiting on the 4K...

the old saying goes, "First time? Shame on you. Second time? Shame on me."

I'm sure the 4K is a dream.
But so far with the way BMD has handled the release of the BMC 2.5 it will remain in most people's dreams.

They say this camera will ship in July.
Truth is, with all the other demands on BMD's previous design, that dawg don't hunt.
BMD has failed to meet delivery targets from the get go....

So when Christmas 2013 arrives and filmmakers are still waiting on the 4K...
the old saying goes, "First time? Shame on you. Second time? Shame on me."

Out of curiosity, what part of the third party's failure to deliver the sensor because of their QA issues (which BM could not possibly have anticipated or done much about) do you not understand?

I'm sure the 4K is a dream.

But so far with the way BMD has handled the release of the BMC 2.5 it will remain in most people's dreams.

They say this camera will ship in July.

Truth is, with all the other demands on BMD's previous design, that dawg don't hunt.

BMD has failed to meet delivery targets from the get go....

So when Christmas 2013 arrives and filmmakers are still waiting on the 4K...

the old saying goes, "First time? Shame on you. Second time? Shame on me."

I find this article interesting: http://www.eoshd.com/content/10079/why- ... ip-in-july

Hey sorry if i missed it but whats the cop factor on this camera

I feel like the people who are posting that we "drama queens" and "cry babies" who don't understand the ever changing face of technology are the same ones who go to little organic Indie film festivals every year like Sundance, meeting their Indie friends at starbucks and telling stories about having to fly coach to the location of their little 400,000 dollar indie film.

Maybe I am a dreamer (but I think it goes with the job description), I saw BMD as something bigger than just a established soft/hardware company and now camera giant. Believe it or not there are still some of us who had to save for this camera. there are some of us who still film in allies, no permits and little more than a dream, and the hope the police won't show up and ask us for our media. some of us had to refill thousands of sodas, to get the very best camera the day job variety film maker could get, manufactured by someone we believed understood. By a company we thought was breaking the mold, by leveling the playing field and making the very best tools available to most anyone who wanted them, in exchange for just a little more patience, and understanding. letting the stories become the issue again. But alas...

So before you grandstand on your vast, advanced intellect or ability to buy the whole family of cameras why not try a little empathy? I am by far not the worst off of the broke Indie film makers in the world but I do feel a little duped. Attari still plays video games but imagine if you bought one last thursday because the gaming community, attari, and the lady behind the counter told you it was the single most technologically advanced gaming system there was, only to, once you payed for it wait 2min (sunday) and sell the guy behind you a PS4 for $10 more (1grand). but I guess they did offer to take it back for a $3 (15%) restocking fee... (universal shutter and 35mm sensor are that big to the no budget, no favors indie film maker)

Black Magic owes me NOTHING! but in turn if I go on feeling the way I am feeling now I will owe them nothing when RED brings scarlet (or someone/something similar) down to the price point realm of possibility. As for now BMD is in a unique position of pioneering unparalleled innovations, and catering to a starving demographic, but it won't always be the only show in this town. The question is in light of the, shall we say less than stellar PR moves, when BM has to begin sharing the stage with another low cost, high value competitor "why should I or people like me stay?" Loyalty is earned not given. Customer services isn't merely about providing qulity or unique a good or service, it's about the manor in which you do it. We all know what REDs focus is but have you read their letter to customers who waited through the rough times, delays, and difficulties? it wasn't sorry this dragon sensor is better it's just different and your cameras still awesome (and they at least waited some years in between) they didn't owe them that letter, it may be BS, but I bet Mx customers feel a dang sight better tonight about their purchase than I do.

equivalent of the late night text you wish you didn't send, for give my novel like rant... Venting

I feel like the people who are posting that we "drama queens" and "cry babies" who don't understand the ever changing face of technology are the same ones who go to little organic Indie film festivals every year like Sundance, meeting their Indie friends at starbucks and telling stories about having to fly coach to the location of their little 400,000 dollar indie film.

Maybe I am a dreamer (but I think it goes with the job description), I saw BMD as something bigger than just a established soft/hardware company and now camera giant. Believe it or not there are still some of us who had to save for this camera. there are some of us who still film in allies, no permits and little more than a dream, and the hope the police won't show up and ask us for our media. some of us had to refill thousands of sodas, to get the very best camera the day job variety film maker could get, manufactured by someone we believed understood. By a company we thought was breaking the mold, by leveling the playing field and making the very best tools available to most anyone who wanted them, in exchange for just a little more patience, and understanding. letting the stories become the issue again. But alas...

So before you grandstand on your vast, advanced intellect or ability to buy the whole family of cameras why not try a little empathy? I am by far not the worst off of the broke Indie film makers in the world but I do feel a little duped. Attari still plays video games but imagine if you bought one last thursday because the gaming community, attari, and the lady behind the counter told you it was the single most technologically advanced gaming system there was, only to, once you payed for it wait 2min (sunday) and sell the guy behind you a PS4 for $10 more (1grand). but I guess they did offer to take it back for a $3 (15%) restocking fee... (universal shutter and 35mm sensor are that big to the no budget, no favors indie film maker)

Black Magic owes me NOTHING! but in turn if I go on feeling the way I am feeling now I will owe them nothing when RED brings scarlet (or someone/something similar) down to the price point realm of possibility. As for now BMD is in a unique position of pioneering unparalleled innovations, and catering to a starving demographic, but it won't always be the only show in this town. The question is in light of the, shall we say less than stellar PR moves, when BM has to begin sharing the stage with another low cost, high value competitor "why should I or people like me stay?" Loyalty is earned not given. Customer services isn't merely about providing qulity or unique a good or service, it's about the manor in which you do it. We all know what REDs focus is but have you read their letter to customers who waited through the rough times, delays, and difficulties? it wasn't sorry this dragon sensor is better it's just different and your cameras still awesome (and they at least waited some years in between) they didn't owe them that letter, it may be BS, but I bet Mx customers feel a dang sight better tonight about their purchase than I do.

equivalent of the late night text you wish you didn't send, for give my novel like rant... Venting

When you are right...you are really damn right! Such a relatable read...needed to be said.

Hey sorry if i missed it but whats the cop factor on this camera

APS-C (~1.6 crop relative to full-frame 135 still photography.)

I was at NAB this week, and spoke to 2 different Blackmagic people at the show. There is no upgrade or trade in policy with the BMCC toward the BMPC. Also, there is no way to firmware add global shutter. According to the guy at BM, it is a "different technology".

When I was told the 4K camera would ship in July, I had a hard time not laughing. The thing is still in beta, and July is 3 months away. Since the 2 cameras use the same housing, I can't see that they would be able to produce BMCC EF, MFT, and 4K cameras fast enough to fulfill orders. Keep in mind July is a "target" date and so far BM has missed the target every time with their cameras.

I was at NAB this week, and spoke to 2 different Blackmagic people at the show. There is no upgrade or trade in policy with the BMCC toward the BMPC. Also, there is no way to firmware add global shutter. According to the guy at BM, it is a "different technology".

When I was told the 4K camera would ship in July, I had a hard time not laughing. The thing is still in beta, and July is 3 months away. Since the 2 cameras use the same housing, I can't see that they would be able to produce BMCC EF, MFT, and 4K cameras fast enough to fulfill orders. Keep in mind July is a "target" date and so far BM has missed the target every time with their cameras.

Have they had other cameras in the past? Since they're using a different sensor from a different company, there's really no reason to expect the same delays. For all we know they could have a couple of thousand cases with screens etc there, waiting for the sensors.

You might be right, they might miss that target, but they might not. I think we need more than one past camera to establish how good or not they are with targets.

Is BMD adding uncompress RAW on the BMPC 4K in future firmware update?

Probably not. The required data rates are likely too high for the recording system.

John Brawley says:
"... Recording to the same media in RAW would be impossible at 4K data rates uncompressed in RAW so they’ve had to stick with ProRes for the moment. It’s still visually lossless at 2.5:1 though. They are planning to introduce compressed RAW DNG’s later on down the track. This is probably one of the first cameras to use the new 6GB/s HD-SDI standard too, which allows for lots of interesting possibilities down the track. I think there’s plans for the better 12 bit flavours of ProRes but for now it’s 10bit 422. ..."

Excerpted from:
http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... e-orginal/

The files are basically zipped for storage... The actual images are not compressed with a loss by using encoding.

I was at NAB this week, and spoke to 2 different Blackmagic people at the show. There is no upgrade or trade in policy with the BMCC toward the BMPC. Also, there is no way to firmware add global shutter. According to the guy at BM, it is a "different technology". ...

This has all been reported previously, but thanks for the further confirmation.

The sensor in the BMPC-4K camera is completely different from the one in the original BMCC, and is made by a different manufacturer. That's why the original BMCC won't be upgradable to become a BMPC-4K: Both the sensor and processor electronics are different.

This is interesting news, though as someone who just received their BMCC, I can't say I'm feeling remorseful at all. The Production Camera might have 4K, but who seriously needs 4K at this stage? Serious question by the way.

We've got zero need for 4K, and I doubt we ever will. The 35mm sensor is an attractive prospect, but $1000 is a fair chunk of cash to drop for it, especially given we'd be sacrificing uncompressed RAW recording capability and a stop of dynamic range.

That's my two cents anyway.

To those who question if BMD can deliver...
BMD has more than just a camera to build. They build lots of things. And as a business each product has teams of people in charge of development, sourcing, prototyping, assembly etc.
When Chevy Volt was doing its' death spiral, did that change whether you could get a truck? No.
Did that change the development of the Corvette? No.
I keep thinking that people on here have got to be smarter than the Nancy Kerrigan "Why Me?!" cry babies, but no, everyone has some telepathic connection into the bowels of BMD and the answer to a question of can they deliver. Sad.

Again, being a company, they are in business. If something goes sideways, they either tell you or not. They told us. Sensor problem. Not every sensor, just the one's on the maiden camera. What the hell does the BMCC have to do with the BMPC or the BM4K? But people just wont let it go. Are BMD supposed to call the networks and hold a press conference to state one more time the same statement? No.

So onward the threads continue to get bogged down with the same crap. People, cruise liners lose power, trains derail, milk goes bad, monkeys attack people, brussel sprouts taste like rotting feet, apples have worms, tires go flat, pennies land tails up. What part of life dont some of you get? The age old question of "Are we there yet" will be answered when we get there. If you ordered 2.5 and got one, bravo. If you dont want it now, sell it. No amount of "Why me!?" is going to change where we all are in the journey. We still aint there yet and if you ask again, the answer will be the same.

My perfect solution is that there should be a "Im not happy" thread where all this stuff can go, so that real content can populate threads like this. Yes waiting on something you REALLY want sucks. We all get that, beyond that point.... we aint there yet.

Brawley has made it clear that with the BMCC V1, there's no chance on any faster frame rates for over cranking and that the hardware just can't handle it.
I'm on the fense right now with this camera, but I wonder if its possible via a down-the-road firmware upgrade to enable 48/60fps or better.

Brawley has made it clear that with the BMCC V1, there's no chance on any faster frame rates for over cranking and that the hardware just can't handle it.
I'm on the fense right now with this camera, but I wonder if its possible via a down-the-road firmware upgrade to enable 48/60fps or better.

Ya know that is what made me really want to order both the pocket and the 4k. I think the pocket can handle the night shoot and danger shots with the full DR, while the 4k gets the standard foundation work. And as you mention, the hopes that down the road firmware expand on the 4k. Can you imagine the pocket camera mounted on that MoVi stabilizer?!!? And the end results of both cameras being very close to each other so post work in resolve or speedgrade is not a hair pulling experience. I had to think long and hard before cancelling my 2.5k order, but did so thinking in these terms of adding the pocket cam down the line.

Hey sorry if i missed it but whats the cop factor on this camera

The crop factor compared to a full-frame sensor with a horizontal of 36mm is 1.7x or slightly greater than the Canon APS-C crop factor of 1.6x. You can do the math yourself as the horizontal dimension of the BMPC4K is 21.12mm.

It is appropriate to compare it to the Super35 width of 24.89mm and in that comparison the BMPC4K has a crop of less than 1.18x.

Rick Lang
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Brawley has made it clear that with the BMCC V1, there's no chance on any faster frame rates for over cranking and that the hardware just can't handle it.
I'm on the fense right now with this camera, but I wonder if its possible via a down-the-road firmware upgrade to enable 48/60fps or better.

I'm am most likely missing some key parameters, but 4k @ 30p is about the same data rate as 2k @ 120p. What's the holdup. My little GoPro Hero 3 Black does 120 and it's going through a compression chip, not raw to a SSD. What am I missing?

To those who question if BMD can deliver...
BMD has more than just a camera to build. They build lots of things. And as a business each product has teams of people in charge of development, sourcing, prototyping, assembly etc.
When Chevy Volt was doing its' death spiral, did that change whether you could get a truck? No.
Did that change the development of the Corvette? No.
I keep thinking that people on here have got to be smarter than the Nancy Kerrigan "Why Me?!" cry babies, but no, everyone has some telepathic connection into the bowels of BMD and the answer to a question of can they deliver. Sad.

Again, being a company, they are in business. If something goes sideways, they either tell you or not. They told us. Sensor problem. Not every sensor, just the one's on the maiden camera. What the hell does the BMCC have to do with the BMPC or the BM4K? But people just wont let it go. Are BMD supposed to call the networks and hold a press conference to state one more time the same statement? No.

So onward the threads continue to get bogged down with the same crap. People, cruise liners lose power, trains derail, milk goes bad, monkeys attack people, brussel sprouts taste like rotting feet, apples have worms, tires go flat, pennies land tails up. What part of life dont some of you get? The age old question of "Are we there yet" will be answered when we get there. If you ordered 2.5 and got one, bravo. If you dont want it now, sell it. No amount of "Why me!?" is going to change where we all are in the journey. We still aint there yet and if you ask again, the answer will be the same.

My perfect solution is that there should be a "Im not happy" thread where all this stuff can go, so that real content can populate threads like this. Yes waiting on something you REALLY want sucks. We all get that, beyond that point.... we aint there yet.

+1

Brawley has made it clear that with the BMCC V1, there's no chance on any faster frame rates for over cranking and that the hardware just can't handle it.
I'm on the fense right now with this camera, but I wonder if its possible via a down-the-road firmware upgrade to enable 48/60fps or better.

I'm am most likely missing some key parameters, but 4k @ 30p is about the same data rate as 2k @ 120p. What's the holdup. My little GoPro Hero 3 Black does 120 and it's going through a compression chip, not raw to a SSD. What am I missing?

What are you missing? I don't know . . . Maybe that you're not on retainer as a consultant, or part of the engineering team? The BMCC's and the Hero3 both have sensors but they're not the same . . .

I'm no better qualified then you but would guess the BM probably records at a significantly higher data rate than the GoPro (which would be putting it mildly), and that heat may be a factor.

If you actually think about it, adding higher frame rates would only increase sales, so it would make little sense to withhold it (except perhaps if it would delay projected delivery). This was mentioned in at least a couple of the videos I watched from NAB. I'd take bets that they will continue to look at it and, if it can be done, will be added through a firmware update (but I wouldn't count on it).

Regarding other speculation . . . at NAB they said late July for release of the first cameras?
My money's on BM not only meeting that date but actually delivering prior to that . . .
(and what will the nay-sayers do then?).

When I was told the 4K camera would ship in July, I had a hard time not laughing. The thing is still in beta, and July is 3 months away. Since the 2 cameras use the same housing, I can't see that they would be able to produce BMCC EF, MFT, and 4K cameras fast enough to fulfill orders. Keep in mind July is a "target" date and so far BM has missed the target every time with their cameras.

The first one was still in beta 3 months away from shipping and they did get an initial batch out before the sensor issue occurred. I have a better feeling about this cam. They're aware of the issues the first camera went through (how could they not be) and I believe they'll do a better job this time. Last time was sort of a freak occurrence.

And If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong but I have a good feeling they'll deliver either on time or slightly after the targeted date.

When I was told the 4K camera would ship in July, I had a hard time not laughing. The thing is still in beta, and July is 3 months away. Since the 2 cameras use the same housing, I can't see that they would be able to produce BMCC EF, MFT, and 4K cameras fast enough to fulfill orders. Keep in mind July is a "target" date and so far BM has missed the target every time with their cameras.

The first one was still in beta 3 months away from shipping and they did get an initial batch out before the sensor issue occurred. I have a better feeling about this cam. They're aware of the issues the first camera went through (how could they not be) and I believe they'll do a better job this time. Last time was sort of a freak occurrence.

And If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong but I have a good feeling they'll deliver either on time or slightly after the targeted date.

I have serious doubt about the 4k arriving in July 2013. Once bitten twice shy.
The pocket camera though might be a possibility. It is at a much lower price point on a consumer level and appears to be tested already.

The thing is beta testers should be getting both of these cameras now if it has any chance of meeting this July's delivery. So far the indication is it will not.

I have serious doubt about the 4k arriving in July 2013. Once bitten twice shy.
The pocket camera though might be a possibility. It is at a much lower price point on a consumer level and appears to be tested already.

The thing is beta testers should be getting both of these cameras now if it has any chance of meeting this July's delivery. So far the indication is it will not.

I definitely understand why people feel this way. I could be wrong. I just have a feeling that delivery for the Production Cam 4K will not be anywhere near as frustrating as the BMCC. If they don't meet the end of July target, I feel like it will be shorty thereafter.

Just my opinion, but I can see why others are skeptical. Totally understandable.

I've decided to pre-order the new BMPC-4K, and drop my pre-order for the BMCC-MFT; details are on my blog:
http://herefortheweather.wordpress.com/ ... which-one/