4.6k Shipments

Most people know there are a ton of people waiting not-so-patiently for their 4.6k unit be it an URSA mini or an URSA turret. Since Blackmagic is barely saying anything at all to anyone, including their distributor and retailers, I figured I would share my timeline to help others extrapolate a timeline for themselves.

I placed an order on May 26th through Adorama. On June 30th I contacted 1 Source Video (BMD distributor, so I'm told) they apologized for the lack of communication from BMD yadda yadda. The gentleman told me they halted production because the sensors were not performing up to standard, even after the decision to pull the global shutter. He said the problems had been fixed and production and shipment had already began ramping up at the time of the conversation but it was slow.

Today (July 7th) I received word from Adorama:

{Hi Matt,

Thank you for your inquiry on the status of your backorder.

According to the manufacturer estimates, we expect to fulfill your order for the Blackmagic Design URSA Mini 4.6K Camera next week.

Please note this is just estimated date given to us by the manufacturer. They are generally accurate, but are subject to change at the discretion of manufacturer.}

I'm sure I am not the only person to get this message and/or have that "next week" turn into more.

Hope this was some help to someone.

Most people know there are a ton of people waiting not-so-patiently for their 4.6k unit be it an URSA mini or an URSA turret. Since Blackmagic is barely saying anything at all to anyone, including their distributor and retailers, I figured I would share my timeline to help others extrapolate a timeline for themselves.

I placed an order on May 26th through Adorama. On June 30th I contacted 1 Source Video (BMD distributor, so I'm told) they apologized for the lack of communication from BMD yadda yadda. The gentleman told me they halted production because the sensors were not performing up to standard, even after the decision to pull the global shutter. He said the problems had been fixed and production and shipment had already began ramping up at the time of the conversation but it was slow.

Today (July 7th) I received word from Adorama:

{Hi Matt,

Thank you for your inquiry on the status of your backorder.

According to the manufacturer estimates, we expect to fulfill your order for the Blackmagic Design URSA Mini 4.6K Camera next week.

Please note this is just estimated date given to us by the manufacturer. They are generally accurate, but are subject to change at the discretion of manufacturer.}

I'm sure I am not the only person to get this message and/or have that "next week" turn into more.

Hope this was some help to someone.

I'm in Toronto and I just left my reseller, Vistek. I also purchased my order on the 26 of May. They told me next due date is next week. Hopefully it comes and shipments continue

This sounds good. Thanks for letting us know.

Thats great news! BMD should really communicate this thing in the open, its not like we don't appreciate that they halted production to fix a problem. If the end cause is waiting, its better than having a problematic camera!

I've been #2 in the queue at my Swedish retailer for months. Preordered UM 4.6K PL in november last year.

Alright! Hope that means 4.0 firmware will be released 'real soon now.'


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Alright! Hope that means 4.0 firmware will be released 'real soon now.'


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As opposed to "coming soon" or............ "july."

Real soon now, often written as RSN, is computer programmer speak for "it's ready when it's ready" or "I know you want it yesterday but I haven't a clue when."

BMD has broken new ground in the lexicon, where 'July' is now recognized as a new synonym for RSN. That's why I was hoping for a June release of 4.0. Maybe it'll arrive next week, maybe next month, or not.


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I've been #2 in the queue at my Swedish retailer for months. Preordered UM 4.6K PL in november last year.

Me too, but EF.
Got mine in April.

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Real soon now, often written as RSN, is computer programmer speak for "it's ready when it's ready" or "I know you want it yesterday but I haven't a clue when."

BMD has broken new ground in the lexicon, where 'July' is now recognized as a new synonym for RSN. That's why I was hoping for a June release of 4.0. Maybe it'll arrive next week, maybe next month, or not.


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Any rough estimate on release? Q3, Q4?

The press release states "The Blackmagic URSA Mini camera OS will be available later this year as a free update for all Blackmagic URSA Mini customers." - https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/media/ ... 0160418-04

However, there have been comments made about it being late summer. We'll have to wait and see when it gets released. There are many anticipating the release, myself included.

I hope it's released RSN but we need to remember that there was never a written promise from BMD that it would be July.



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Real soon now, often written as RSN, is computer programmer speak for "it's ready when it's ready" or "I know you want it yesterday but I haven't a clue when."

BMD has broken new ground in the lexicon, where 'July' is now recognized as a new synonym for RSN. That's why I was hoping for a June release of 4.0. Maybe it'll arrive next week, maybe next month, or not.

I was born on the fourth of July. Does that mean, to maintain a certain hip-ness in my lexicon, I should start saying my birthday is the fourth of RSN?

Maybe the ambiguity may result in a longer period during which I may celebrate, and receive gifts.

Oh my, I don't know quite how to break this to you, Tristan. RSN now can at times imply 'never' and that's particularly true of some infamous events in the past of cinematography. Case in point, the RED 3K for $3K. So you might say your birthday is the fourth of never. That might sound depressing but all America is ablaze in Chinese fireworks every fourth of never. I never knew what that celebration was about until now. Happy birthday!


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From my reseller, New Media Australia:
Hi Paul,
New Magic expect camera deliveries to resume next week but can’t say if they’ll receive enough to fill your order.
Regards
Geoff

Spanish resellers told me that BMD isnt manufacturing Ursa mini 4 or 4.6K. And I don't find any international online store that have a single 4.6K EF in stock...

Lucky one


www.kaiz3r.net

Like I said before, I got the "next week" earlier this week. I'll report next week to see if it is indeed next week, next week. Or if next week is not next week and turns into more than next week. We'll see...next week...I think...

My local dealer in Australia told me over the phone he believes the manufacturing has now restarted and shipments will start coming through in the next few weeks. I'm first on their list so we'll see Oh and I did ask about the PL version and its his understanding that they're a few months away at the earliest... so EF it is

This clearly is a global supply issue and imho I'm guessing its more to do with the Japanese earthquake than the magenta issue... I was also told if I switch to a Sony FS5/7 then they wouldn't be able to supply until early next year! Lets hope BM have used this 'break' to fix all the gremlins

I phoned CVP yesterday to enquire the possible delivery time on a 4.6k UM if i placed an order now they said NINE months!!!!

Im still dithering as to whether or not to place an order with the magenta issue still ongoing.

Pete, if you can cancel the order before it ships, then there's no harm in placing an order now. Does CVP also notify you prior to shipment to confirm you still want the camera? Even if they don't always do that, you could request they confirm with you prior to shipping the camera.


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My local dealer in Australia told me over the phone he believes the manufacturing has now restarted and shipments will start coming through in the next few weeks. I'm first on their list so we'll see Oh and I did ask about the PL version and its his understanding that they're a few months away at the earliest... so EF it is

This clearly is a global supply issue and imho I'm guessing its more to do with the Japanese earthquake than the magenta issue... I was also told if I switch to a Sony FS5/7 then they wouldn't be able to supply until early next year! Lets hope BM have used this 'break' to fix all the gremlins

I speculated about the same thing in a different topic on this forum. Coincidental timing.

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Mathew I wasn't suggesting its a Sony sensor though anything is possible but there were many companies affected by the earthquake. This from PC World, April 15.

"Renesas Electronics and Mitsubishi Electric have neighboring plants in Kumamoto, the former making automotive chips and the latter power devices. Operations were suspended at both plants as a result of the earthquakes, Japanese media said.
Mitsubishi Electric also suspended an LCD parts facility and a semiconductor plant in the area."

These cameras aren't just 'sensors in a box' so it could be any number of part holding up the show...

People here want to blame BMD but you have to ask yourself why would a company that's honest and open and eager to please stay silent? It doesn't make sense? unless... you're being gagged I don't agree BMD doesn't want us to know it may be a Sony sensor... probably the other way around... Sony makes sensors for a lot of companies and if word got out they can't supply these companies sensors it could be financially catastrophic for them... companies jumping ship etc... plus they may want to protect their own cinema camera business.... who knows right? Plus this could apply to any sensor manufacturer really.

Don't ya love speculation

If it's the earthquake that retard delivery, why not said it ? If it was that, bmd can tell us, anyone can understand that this event can complicate things.
The part strange is that we have nothing at all from bmd to explain why it take so long to ship camera


www.kaiz3r.net

I phoned blackmagic UK they said it was indeed the supply from the factory that was the hold up, didn't mention any earthquake tho. Apparently the factory wont give any dates to BMD. Still strange how silent this forum is from BMD tho, they got a lot of respect for opening their mouths on the magenta issue. but seemed to have gone back to their old silent ways on shipping info despite knowing it causes public opinion to drop time and time again.

Pete, if you can cancel the order before it ships, then there's no harm in placing an order now. Does CVP also notify you prior to shipment to confirm you still want the camera? Even if they don't always do that, you could request they confirm with you prior to shipping the camera.


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Thats not a bad shout Rick, then if the Magenta issue hasn't been fixed i can cancel.

My local dealer in Australia told me over the phone he believes the manufacturing has now restarted and shipments will start coming through in the next few weeks. I'm first on their list so we'll see Oh and I did ask about the PL version and its his understanding that they're a few months away at the earliest... so EF it is

This clearly is a global supply issue and imho I'm guessing its more to do with the Japanese earthquake than the magenta issue... I was also told if I switch to a Sony FS5/7 then they wouldn't be able to supply until early next year! Lets hope BM have used this 'break' to fix all the gremlins

I speculated about the same thing in a different topic on this forum. Coincidental timing.

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Not sure if this was the older generation of sensors but I thought Fairchild develpoed the sensor.

http://www.fairchildimaging.com

My local dealer in Australia told me over the phone he believes the manufacturing has now restarted and shipments will start coming through in the next few weeks. I'm first on their list so we'll see Oh and I did ask about the PL version and its his understanding that they're a few months away at the earliest... so EF it is

This clearly is a global supply issue and imho I'm guessing its more to do with the Japanese earthquake than the magenta issue... I was also told if I switch to a Sony FS5/7 then they wouldn't be able to supply until early next year! Lets hope BM have used this 'break' to fix all the gremlins

I speculated about the same thing in a different topic on this forum. Coincidental timing.

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Not sure if this was the older generation of sensors but I thought Fairchild develpoed the sensor.

http://www.fairchildimaging.com

Very well could have been one of the older sensor models.

Unless I missed it, I have not seen anything official about the manufacturer of the 4.6k sensor. Not that it particularly matters, I'm just nosey and like to know all I can before I buy.

It is very unlikely that Sony is the manufacturer of the sensor.
1.) If they had developed a sensor switchable between rolling and global shutter, then we would have seen that sensor in Sony cameras too.
2.) Sony would have made switching between shutter types work for BMD.

In 2012 those were the top 10 (market share) of CMOS sensor manufacturers

1. Sony - 21%
2. Omnivision - 19%
3. Samsung - 18%
4. Canon - 9%
5. Aptina Imaging - 8%
6. Toshiba - 6%
7. STMicroelectronics - 4%
8. Nikon - 4%
9. GalaxyCore - 4%
10. SiliconFile - 2%

BTW:
In 2014 Omnivision was no. 1.
In 2015 Sony owned an estimated 40% market share and is now no. 1.

CMOSIS could be the manufacturer of the 4.6k sensor (5.5 μm) with a custom design based on the CMV12000 (5.5 μm) or a predecessor design of it. It has a HDR of 90dB (~15 stops)

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Has been discussed here and in the other forum before and you can also find it easily via google..

It has been established that the sensor is based on the new Fairchild Imaging sCMOS LTN4625A, allegedly a highly customized derivate though according to BM.

(the Pocket Cam uses the Fairchild CIS1910, the original Cinema Cam the CIS2521)

I phoned blackmagic UK they said it was indeed the supply from the factory that was the hold up, didn't mention any earthquake tho. Apparently the factory wont give any dates to BMD. Still strange how silent this forum is from BMD tho, they got a lot of respect for opening their mouths on the magenta issue. but seemed to have gone back to their old silent ways on shipping info despite knowing it causes public opinion to drop time and time again.

Someone received a new unit in the UK last week. It was an RMA but none the less a new unit from a new a shipment. I think that possibly the pipes are beginning to flow again but know who's how long the RMA que is

It is very unlikely that Sony is the manufacturer of the sensor.
1.) If they had developed a sensor switchable between rolling and global shutter, then we would have seen that sensor in Sony cameras too.
2.) Sony would have made switching between shutter types work for BMD.

In 2012 those were the top 10 (market share) of CMOS sensor manufacturers

1. Sony - 21%
2. Omnivision - 19%
3. Samsung - 18%
4. Canon - 9%
5. Aptina Imaging - 8%
6. Toshiba - 6%
7. STMicroelectronics - 4%
8. Nikon - 4%
9. GalaxyCore - 4%
10. SiliconFile - 2%

BTW:
In 2014 Omnivision was no. 1.
In 2015 Sony owned an estimated 40% market share and is now no. 1.

CMOSIS could be the manufacturer of the 4.6k sensor (5.5 μm) with a custom design based on the CMV12000 (5.5 μm) or a predecessor design of it. It has a HDR of 90dB (~15 stops)

Robert I never said Sony was the manufacturer... Sony are having delays caused by the earthquake... Couldn't it be plausible that Fairchilds plant could have been affected... Also it could be another component like the LCD screen... or something else electronic manufactured in that area holding up the show?? The magenta issue was only acknowledged by BMD not long ago whereas the shipments stopped at least a few months ago, yes? around the time of the earthquake? but hey I could be waaay off base...

Sony stealing BMD sensor ip tech to put in their own cameras... wait what? huh??

AFAIK Nikon don't make sensors, Sony provides them!

I phoned blackmagic UK they said it was indeed the supply from the factory that was the hold up, didn't mention any earthquake tho. Apparently the factory wont give any dates to BMD. Still strange how silent this forum is from BMD tho, they got a lot of respect for opening their mouths on the magenta issue. but seemed to have gone back to their old silent ways on shipping info despite knowing it causes public opinion to drop time and time again.

Someone received a new unit in the UK last week. It was an RMA but none the less a new unit from a new a shipment. I think that possibly the pipes are beginning to flow again but know who's how long the RMA que is

Its possible though that they are left over from the original first batch set aside for RMA's... again who really knows... I guess we'll find out soon enough

It is very unlikely that Sony is the manufacturer of the sensor.
1.) If they had developed a sensor switchable between rolling and global shutter, then we would have seen that sensor in Sony cameras too.
2.) Sony would have made switching between shutter types work for BMD.

In 2012 those were the top 10 (market share) of CMOS sensor manufacturers

1. Sony - 21%
2. Omnivision - 19%
3. Samsung - 18%
4. Canon - 9%
5. Aptina Imaging - 8%
6. Toshiba - 6%
7. STMicroelectronics - 4%
8. Nikon - 4%
9. GalaxyCore - 4%
10. SiliconFile - 2%

BTW:
In 2014 Omnivision was no. 1.
In 2015 Sony owned an estimated 40% market share and is now no. 1.

CMOSIS could be the manufacturer of the 4.6k sensor (5.5 μm) with a custom design based on the CMV12000 (5.5 μm) or a predecessor design of it. It has a HDR of 90dB (~15 stops)

Robert I never said Sony was the manufacturer... Sony are having delays caused by the earthquake... Couldn't it be plausible that Fairchilds plant could have been affected... Also it could be another component like the LCD screen... or something else electronic manufactured in that area holding up the show?? The magenta issue was only acknowledged by BMD not long ago whereas the shipments stopped at least a few months ago, yes? around the time of the earthquake? but hey I could be waaay off base...

Sony stealing BMD sensor ip tech to put in their own cameras... wait what? huh??

AFAIK Nikon don't make sensors, Sony provides them!

Robert: I don't think Sony developed the sensor, but they could be manufacturing it according to specs developed by BMD. We wouldn't necessarily see the same sensor from Sony as every manufactorer likes to have their own special sauce for their product. That goes back to the beginnings of video.

Lots of things could have changed in the 2 months or so between the beta batch and the first production batch, like a flaw that causes magenta vignetting. Regardless of where or by who the sensor is being made, manufacturing flaws like this happen.

It very well could be the CMOSIS sensor. I looked at that last summer but was unable to get confirmation from anyone at BMD if that's where the're coming out of. Again, It doesn't REALLY matter, just trying to provide SOME context for this epic mishandling of a product launch.

John: That's an interesting point about the theft of technology. I doubt it exists anywhere formally, but look into the history and coincidence in timing between the release of the Editcam by Ikegami and Sony's first hard drive cam. Jussaying...

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Has been discussed here and in the other forum before and you can also find it easily via google..

It has been established that the sensor is based on the new Fairchild Imaging sCMOS LTN4625A, allegedly a highly customized derivate though according to BM.

(the Pocket Cam uses the Fairchild CIS1910, the original Cinema Cam the CIS2521)

Yup, it's been discussed here in multiple threads. I guess with how many people are coming to the BMD family because of the 4.6's popularity there will be the same questions asked multiple times a week.

Good for BMD, not so great for a tidy forum.

I have not been able to find out or hear from anyone else who actually makes BMD new sensor. It's understandable if they don't want people to know it's manufactured by Sony.

Has been discussed here and in the other forum before and you can also find it easily via google..

It has been established that the sensor is based on the new Fairchild Imaging sCMOS LTN4625A, allegedly a highly customized derivate though according to BM.

(the Pocket Cam uses the Fairchild CIS1910, the original Cinema Cam the CIS2521)

Yup, it's been discussed here in multiple threads. I guess with how many people are coming to the BMD family because of the 4.6's popularity there will be the same questions asked multiple times a week.

Good for BMD, not so great for a tidy forum.

Did BMD confirm this? Links would help because I don't see anything from them confirming.

BMD follows Apple's lead. They don't public ally disclose details of product production. End of story.


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Robert I never said Sony was the manufacturer...

John, I wasn't implying that you said that.
I was just thinking out loud why I thought Sony wouldn't be the manufacturer of BMD's sensor.

Couldn't it be plausible that Fairchilds plant could have been affected...

No, that is not plausible because Fairchild has no plants in Japan:
https://www.fairchildsemi.com/about/locations/

Sony stealing BMD sensor ip tech to put in their own cameras... wait what? huh??

I think you have a wrong impression how this kind of development works. It is not that BMD has some CMOS sensor design gurus in their team. They go to a specialist like Fairchild/CMOSIS/Sony/whoever and tell them the specs they want and need. And the specialist tells them if it is possible, how long it will take and how much it will cost to develop. If they agree then it all starts. But BMD would have to invest a lot more and buy huge amounts of sensors to prevent the manufacturer from using the new developed skills/tech in other stock products sooner or later.
If you want an exclusive deal for a product you need to shell out lots of money.

It is like you either buy a cheap non-exclusive music license from you composer (so he can sell it several times for profit) or you make a buy-out and pay much more for an exclusive license.

AFAIK Nikon don't make sensors, Sony provides them!

According to those tech sites I used as source for the top 10, Nikon does make sensors.

Robert I never said Sony was the manufacturer...

John, I wasn't implying that you said that.
I was just thinking out loud why I thought Sony wouldn't be the manufacturer of BMD's sensor.

Couldn't it be plausible that Fairchilds plant could have been affected...

No, that is not plausible because Fairchild has no plants in Japan:
https://www.fairchildsemi.com/about/locations/

Sony stealing BMD sensor ip tech to put in their own cameras... wait what? huh??

I think you have a wrong impression how this kind of development works. It is not that BMD has some CMOS sensor design gurus in their team. They go to a specialist like Fairchild/CMOSIS/Sony/whoever and tell them the specs they want and need. And the specialist tells them if it is possible, how long it will take and how much it will cost to develop. If they agree then it all starts. But BMD would have to invest a lot more and buy huge amounts of sensors to prevent the manufacturer from using the new developed skills/tech in other stock products sooner or later.
If you want an exclusive deal for a product you need to shell out lots of money.

It is like you either buy a cheap non-exclusive music license from you composer (so he can sell it several times for profit) or you make a buy-out and pay much more for an exclusive license.

AFAIK Nikon don't make sensors, Sony provides them!

According to those tech sites I used as source for the top 10, Nikon does make sensors.

Ok cool we've debunked the 'sensor in the earthquake' theory still could be another part however someone in another thread claims BMD stopped the sensor production because they weren't coming up to spec... how much that has to do with the magenta issue is anyone's guess? I'm hoping that's true as it'll make a lot of people here happy including myself Just need to get them shipping ASAP!!

"If you want an exclusive deal for a product you need to shell out lots of money."
And I think they have... likely shelled out a ton of money and customized the sensor to meet their needs. I really doubt you'll see that sensor in non-BMD cameras. Pretty sure they own that sensor now. I mean Sony makes Hasselblad's sensors... I wonder what would happen if Sony started making MFD cameras with that exact sensor + tech at a fraction of the cost? Ok they've done collaboration projects together before but they weren't exactly the same camera... and how'd that work out exactly?
I just can't imagine there will be re-badged Fairchild (or whoever) Ursa Mini 4.6k's out there....

Sorry 'made' isn't the correct terminology... I meant Fab'd... IFAIK Nikon only design 'some' of their sensors and fabs them elsewhere same as BMD. Sony designs and fab's probably around 2/3's of them for Nikon yes...

The Nikon 1 series of cameras do example, have a Nikon co-developed developed Aptina fab sensor in them.
DS

According to Tim Siddons speaking at a LA get together many months back, BMD has invested $10M in the 4.6K sensor.


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BMD follows Apple's lead. They don't public ally disclose details of product production. End of story.


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If only they would do what Apple also does, release products when they say they will.

Still no updates BMD?????

BMD follows Apple's lead. They don't public ally disclose details of product production. End of story.


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If only they would do what Apple also does, release products when they say they will.

Be careful what you wish for...

It's been 15 weeks now since the last URSA MINI 4.6K's entered the UK, Yet all we get is silence from BM. How much longer should we wait before we jump ship? We are trying to be loyal but its getting very hard sticking by empty promises, even a time frame would be nice. All we've heard from the BM representatives is that the cameras are shipping as normal. BTW lying doesn't save you face it makes you sound incompetent.

Well that's untrue. I've had two new ones in three weeks...

Well that's untrue. I've had two new ones in three weeks...

Both could be true. Maybe your replacements were not "new" into the UK? I don't know how the market works across the pond.

It's been 15 weeks now since the last URSA MINI 4.6K's entered the UK, Yet all we get is silence from BM. How much longer should we wait before we jump ship? We are trying to be loyal but its getting very hard sticking by empty promises, even a time frame would be nice. All we've heard from the BM representatives is that the cameras are shipping as normal. BTW lying doesn't save you face it makes you sound incompetent.

I know your feels. In the US there are people who have received, replaced (sometimes more than once), and returned units already. Today, 7/14 is 7 weeks since my order was placed.

I am choosing to believe it is because all the receiving and returning that is happening is with units before the sensor issues were fixed, and that I placed me order right as the fixes were under way, and that my unit will be free of all the issues people are having. I have no evidence to support this, but it making it slightly easier to wait. Slightly.

regardless there's no excuse. this is a corporate company. we should be informed about our purchases. im ready to boycott cause this some bs. if shipment has stopped which it seem liked, due to whatever reason they should state there is a hold up. instead no one from BMD has anything to say. you work for a company and no one has no answers? they playing with us. we dont deserve that respect when we the one putting money in there pockets. ima flame this whole forum until i get an answer. if thats what it takes. the moment i get my camera ill be ok, all smiles, but until then, with no answers to whats happening im not staying silent. might as well switch to another camera. i demand respect and i feel well disrespected. again some BS

Well that's untrue. I've had two new ones in three weeks...

Holden have confirmed when I called them that no new cameras have entered the UK in 15 weeks!

Holden have confirmed when I called them that no new cameras have entered the UK in 15 weeks!

Might I suggest buying another camera for the time being? If you're starting from scratch, the FS7 is about the same price and has about the same features (minus recording options) and should hold it's value well. You could buy that in the interim and still grab the ursa mini when it becomes available by selling the FS7.

There's almost certainly a really good reason that they're not shipping (like QC issues) and if they really haven't shipped in almost 4 months, you'll drive yourself crazy waiting, man.

Life's too short and there are so many options!

Just a suggestion.

get the URSA mini 4K