Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be about

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Hans Engstrom

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Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be about

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 11:18 am

I will start with an appolgy. This topic is not about shooting with the Blackmagic Cinema Camera and I´m sorry about that but it will be the last and only one from me that´s not about SHOOTING with the BMCC.

Cinematography
The place for questions about shooting with the Blackmagic Cinema Camera.

That is the description of this board. I really wish someone would take the time and move all the junk about "when will my camera arrive", "please do this", "don´t do that", "honesty please" etc somewhere else. This board is flooded with posts that are not helping anyone. This is in no way personal against the posters it´s just that this type of posts are not creative at all.

I for one will not stay on this board for long if this continues. I know that this board will do fine without me but what happens if all the people who work in the film industry for a living do the same? Instead of this board acting like a creative place to solve real issues with the camera it will become the next "Wailing wall".

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Hans Engstrom
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Eric Santiago

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 11:42 am

I understand your concerns.
I too am a culprit of feeding the fire.
However, you can sift through the angst easily.
There is only two non-related to creativity on the first page.
Just don't click on them :)
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Andy Smith

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 12:34 pm

Agreed Eric. Just avoid those threads. Additionally you can't very well ask people to discuss using the camera when only 10-20 people have it. Its plain to see that shipping is going to be the number one discussion topic. Once BMD get large numbers out to the public i'm sure the nature of conversation will change.
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Hans Engstrom

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 2:10 pm

Andy Smith wrote:Agreed Eric. Just avoid those threads. Additionally you can't very well ask people to discuss using the camera when only 10-20 people have it. Its plain to see that shipping is going to be the number one discussion topic. Once BMD get large numbers out to the public i'm sure the nature of conversation will change.


You can ask questions about shooting with a camera even if you don´t own one, I know because I have.

Eric Santiago wrote:I understand your concerns.
I too am a culprit of feeding the fire.
However, you can sift through the angst easily.
There is only two non-related to creativity on the first page.
Just don't click on them :)


Four threads (five with this one) on the front page not about shooting with the EXISTING camera.

Shipping dates
Please decouple Blackmagic MFT to match GH3 pricing.
honesty and communication please
Full Frame BMCC

But it´s not the number of threads that matters it´s how the complaints are about the same old all the time. If I can choose between hanging out in a nice and calm enviroment or one that have a lot of people yelling and complaining about stuff that doesn´t belong in that enviroment guess wich one I choose?

And once again this is not against anyone in particular.

Peace
Hans Engstrom
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Mark Wilhelm

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 2:21 pm

This community was created only recently and it's already incredibly active. Once BM staffs up this forum with moderators, I'm optimistic most of Hans' concerns will be relieved.
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 2:33 pm

dear Hans, you can leave this forum if these threads hurt your feeling.
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Hans Engstrom

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 2:55 pm

PetePolyakov wrote:dear Hans, you can leave this forum if these threads hurt your feeling.

Thanks mr Polyakov!
I was just waiting for that comment by someone as generous and contributing as you.

regards
Hans Engstrom
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Andy Smith

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:11 pm

Hans, just start a thread about something you want to discuss. Whether it be about the camera or cinematography or screenwriting. Be part of the solution rather than the problem. I'll happily jump on board if there's something worthy to discuss.
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Hans Engstrom

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:19 pm

Andy Smith wrote:Hans, just start a thread about something you want to discuss. Whether it be about the camera or cinematography or screenwriting. Be part of the solution rather than the problem. I'll happily jump on board if there's something worthy to discuss.


I have done that and I´m interested in what other have to say about the camera and questions they have. What the threads with complaining does is bring a bad tone to the board, if you don´t belive me look a couple of posts up. The posts about when and where also gets bumped all the time drenching relevant posts.

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Hans Engstrom
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Mark de Jeu

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:24 pm

Hans,

I think your sentiment is well placed, with a desire to focus on what adds value. I share your hope, and will be patient to see how this forum develops. If the forum remains lightly moderated, I expect we will continue to see activity from those who tend to agitate and attack.

Hang in there. Your talent and perspective will be an asset to the community.
Mark de Jeu
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simonkn

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:29 pm

Peter.

And indeed anyone else with similar glib remarks...

This is a very small - big industry. You never know who you'll meet, where you'll meet them or indeed - when you might need their help both physical or via the internet.

So asking creative individuals to "go away" is not just rude, but professional suicide..

Think on...

And Hans... Although I hate to agree that just "ignoring" the inappropriate threads is probably the ONLY way to go ahead... I feel your pain, Sir!

SImon K
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:47 pm

Hans Engstrom wrote:
PetePolyakov wrote:dear Hans, you can leave this forum if these threads hurt your feeling.

Thanks mr Polyakov!
I was just waiting for that comment by someone as generous and contributing as you.

regards
Hans Engstrom
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I like bipolarity. I like and respect the fact that you are OK about the situation. But I believe as professionals we should respect other professionals opinions. For example, I'm NOT OK about the fact that BMD has a very poor communication about questions that important for everyone here (or almost everyone). I can survive with your opinion and I believe you can do the same. But if not..

I just can't see when someone is suffering. :)
with love
pete
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Andy Smith

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:54 pm

simonkn wrote:Peter.

And indeed anyone else with similar glib remarks...

This is a very small - big industry. You never know who you'll meet, where you'll meet them or indeed - when you might need their help both physical or via the internet.

So asking creative individuals to "go away" is not just rude, but professional suicide..

Think on...

And Hans... Although I hate to agree that just "ignoring" the inappropriate threads is probably the ONLY way to go ahead... I feel your pain, Sir!

SImon K


Similarly you also need to grow a thick skin and not threaten to walk out or leave when things aren't going your way.

Hans i agree with you that the shipping thread is pretty pointless, but quite a lot of people enjoy that thread. People like a moan and a rant and i think they should have a place to do that. 4 out of 25 threads on the first page is pretty restrained. Funnily enough the thread that always stays at or near the top is John's Afterglow thread. I think that speaks volumes about the forum.
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bhook

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 3:58 pm

Andy Smith wrote:Funnily enough the thread that always stays at or near the top is John's Afterglow thread. I think that speaks volumes about the forum.


It's a sticky. :lol:
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Mark Wilhelm

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 4:10 pm

"Sticky" or "stickied" threads have been "stuck" to the top of the forum in which they reside, ensuring they always appear at the beginning of the list, regardless of last post time. ;)
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bhook

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 4:19 pm

If it weren't a sticky, the last post was 9/11 (with one moved into the thread 9/14), where do you think it would be right now in the forum...second page...third page...?

Come on...not everybody buying the BMC is a cinematographer. There are plenty of us who make our living shooting video and suffer no illusions of becoming the next gr8 filmmaker or colorist. BMD itself invites us into the fold on the product Webpage...in spite of the "cinema" in the name.
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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 4:39 pm

I recall RED would give dates on when there would be an update. That update may or may not have been much of anything, but knowing that at a certain time you could count on some info coming, stopped people from constantly wondering whats going on, feeling forgotten, ignored, devalued, etc.

The incredibly simple task of taking a few min each week to post an update, and after your camera is months late, goes a long way.

It's been six months now, so for some there's little left to talk about other than speculating, sharing these second hand "I heard from this reseller" stories because again, people are desperate for information in this very unfortunate situation (and people jumping on threads to complain about complaining and posting long rants about how personally they can wait forever, don't add anything to the conversation).
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Nick Smith

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 4:40 pm

And to be fair. When the board is about shooting with the BMCC, and so few of us actually have the camera to shoot with. The 'When will I receive mine' threads do have a place.
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Andy Smith

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 4:49 pm

My bad didn't notice the sign thingy. But there you go-important information is stuck at the top concerning shipping so you don't need to trawl the shipping thread for info.
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bhook

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 5:03 pm

Read the history of the shipping sticky and why the shipping thread was left intact and unlocked for member comments.
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paul schefz

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 5:20 pm

think about it....this really is just another thread about the camera not shipping....
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Costa Louvieris

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 5:34 pm

I respect what Hans is saying but politely disagree. People should have a forum to complain If need be. Especially when justified (which I'm afraid shipping date IS indeed justified).

As others have already smartly implied... if you don't like it then move on. Four out of 25 topics on the front page is TAME especially considering how late the camera is. Grow a thicker skin and move on to more cinematography type discussion. I know mbeck has a camera and updated here regularly. In fact his latest topic is about an issue with the audio on the camera. Or are you going to complain at him for not talking about cinematography and moaning?

Sometimes people have a right to complain and this shipping issue is certainly justified.

Costa
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Hans Engstrom

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 6:57 pm

I have said what I wanted to say and this thread as many others are going down the drain.

Bye
Hans Engstrom
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 9:11 pm

at least one here had some b to say something and follow his own words
ciao Hans, it was nice to discuss with you
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simonkn

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostTue Sep 25, 2012 10:11 pm

pss wrote:think about it....this really is just another thread about the camera not shipping....


So eloquently put, and petulantly ignored...

Nice one PSS and a sad au revoir to Hans..
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostWed Sep 26, 2012 3:52 pm

hey Hans, I think time to come back because jaguars got their food :-)
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostWed Sep 26, 2012 10:03 pm

Hans, I would happily discuss cinematography with you one the BMCUser Cinematography.

While I'll probably be shooting some corporatey videos on it, my passion is for learning cinematography.

http://bmcuser.com/forumdisplay.php?18-Cinematography
Nick Bedford, Photographer
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Theodore Prentice

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostWed Sep 26, 2012 11:20 pm

Costa wrote: People should have a forum to complain If need be.

Sometimes people have a right to complain and this shipping issue is certainly justified.



The very reason I despise McDonalds

If Del Frisco's suddenly started selling fillet specials for $12 it would be the same thing.

Complain because you can, wow.

You have a right to be sensible too, and there are quite a few people here (same ones beating the dead horse) that are not.

Blackmagic, take your time, please, the sensible folks who havent sold their homes to buy a bmcc and are now homeless (directed at those that sold their gear to buy something that they couldnt physically buy) will be right here when the camera hits the market.

We understand, and thank you for even offering such a device at a modest price.
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 12:34 am

Theodore Prentice wrote:If Del Frisco suddenly started selling fillet specials for $12 it would be the same thing.


dear Theodore,
showing contempt for minorities doesn't show anything except your own vulgarity.
with love,
pete
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Theodore Prentice

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 1:02 am

PetePolyakov wrote:
Theodore Prentice wrote:If Del Frisco suddenly started selling fillet specials for $12 it would be the same thing.


dear Theodore,
showing contempt for minorities doesn't show anything except your own vulgarity.
with love,
pete



Nice try.

Still ignoring your right to be sensible I see.
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 1:03 am

it's just a statement of fact
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Theodore Prentice

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 1:08 am

Someone is now foolishly speaking of "facts".

Please, at least try to be sensible chap.
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Costa Louvieris

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 6:12 am

Theodore this room had move on with Hans doing as promised and moving on too. Now you start attacking people on the thread... why? To insight more hatred? Let this thread die and stop telling people what they should think and do.

As Hans stated... this forum is about cinematography. And as I am NOW saying, let's keep hatred for others out of things and discuss things civilly.
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Theodore Prentice

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 12:29 pm

Thanks for skewing what I wrote, while ignoring that I was asking for sensibility from some certain forum members.

You read into what I wrote waaaaay to far and somehow got attacks and hatred?

It's a camera folks, calm down, or don't. Or is it only those upset with BM that are allowed to post their 'opinion'?

(and the word is incite, not insight)

Feel free to end the buffoonery at any time.
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Christine Peterson

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Re: Cinematography is what this board is supposed to be abou

PostThu Sep 27, 2012 3:10 pm

Hey guys!

We're locking this thread, as the original point has already been addressed.

And just as a reminder, we'd like this forum to be a place for civilized discussion. We're all professionals, and this forum will work best if we all make an effort to be respectful. If you ever have any concerns about a user or a post that violates our forum rules, please don't hesitate to click the "Report this post" button.

Thanks!
Christine
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